responding to X

[Lovera]

This type of hands makes declaration problem (and discussion with vary point of view confirm it): if let's talk about value we don't have 10 points because 4-3-3-3 has -1 point (svalutation) for shape and -1 for Jxx (honor not protected) than 8 points declaration on level (2♦ 4th), for 1NT bidding is required control in heart otherwise nothing 1NT and if is true that this is hand passed 2♥ required more points (12/13) (spade in N are 4th..), bye.

[kgr]

1NT for me,

but I don't have much experience with it because with my regular partner we play that 1NT is kind of Lebensohl (Leuvensohl) and therefor 2♦ shows 8-10. Easy 2♦ then.

[beatrix45]

This is a real problem hand. Imo, 2♦ is out because two bullets and the red jacks give you too good a hand. The choice is between 1NT and 3♦. RHO is the dog that did not bark in the night. Is RHO broke or just short in ♥? At the table absent any serious tells from the opponents, I wud prob bid 3♦, but 1NT looks OK as well.

[the hog]

1N for my money.

[Tramticket]

2D is a nothing bid promising as few as zero points.

 

3D and 1NT are both reasonable. But 2H looks like a good alternative. Normally it would be a big overbid on this hand - but given that I am already passed ...

[mcphee]

Anyone who even considers 3D please see Dr. Phil. 1NT is rather clear here, it's forward going and the best you can manage.

[MrAce]

Anyone who even considers 3D please see Dr. Phil. 1NT is rather clear here, it's forward going and the best you can manage.

 

 

Yea, walk ins are welcome by Phil King, you may need an appointment by Phil Clayton. Both will cure the 3♦ disease imo.

[PhilKing]

I just threw up in my mouth.

[mikeh]

I just threw up in my mouth.

 

I knew bidding boxes were a great invention, but I'd never understood how great until now. You wouldn't miss a beat.

[cherdano]

a good partner won't drive us to 3nt with nothing in hearts himself without checking we have a stop.

 

I think now you are overstating the case for 1NT. If partner is 3235 without a heart stop and values to force to game, is he really going to look for 5♣ instead of 3NT opposite a balanced hand, while helping opponents to find the best lead and defense against either contract?

 

I agree with 1NT but I also think it will lead to losing the first 5 tricks in 3N now and then.

 

This is different to 1NT rebids opposite a negative double, where partner doesn't even expect a stop. Here he does.

[beatrix45]

Yea, walk ins are welcome by Phil King, you may need an appointment by Phil Clayton. Both will cure the 3♦ disease imo.

Disease or not, I don't seem to be looking at a ♥ stop. If pard's double is based on cards, let him/her bid 3NT after my 3♦ call. If pard has Larry Cohen's model hand - 4-1-4-4 and a minimum he/she will pass, and we will be in the right spot. No one can fault a 1nt bid, but it is a mastermind call. Why should this bid end the auction?

[beatrix45]

There must be a reason this hand keeps coming up in BBO forums. It is, imho, not really marginal. One NT is not really stupid, although your ♥ stop does not actually exist, and your hand way more than a minimum for 2♦, and it is MUCH better suited to suit play than for NT. Just bid 3♦, and let your partner work it out. One NT is not terrible, butt it is basically a dumbass bid. Even worse at IMPs than MP's.

[MrAce]

There must be a reason this hand keeps coming up in BBO forums. It is, imho, not really marginal. One NT is not really stupid, although your ♥ stop does not actually exist, and your hand way more than a minimum for 2♦, and it is MUCH better suited to suit play than for NT. Just bid 3♦, and let your partner work it out. One NT is not terrible, butt it is basically a dumbass bid. Even worse at IMPs than MP's.

 

LOL

[helene_t]

I learned something from this thread. I would have expected the vote to be very diverse, with the experts being divided between 1♠, 1NT, 2♦, 2♥ and 3♦, and maybe a single oddie voting for 2♠ (that bid got one vote in the Dutch Ladderpuzzel on a very similar hand, though one point stronger and without the ♥J. Then, 2♥ was the overwhelming choice). While some non-experts voting pass or 2NT.

 

I am not used to a style in which partner could easily have a doubleton diamonds or a 4333 shape. If playing Raptor, a doubleton diamonds is obviously impossible, and if not there are no tweeners between pass and 1NT although a 15-count with xxx in hearts is possible. Opposite that hand we will probably get to a no-play 3NT anyway unless I make a very conservative 2♦ bid. If not playing Raptor a 2♣ overcall could easily be a 5-card suit although I admit that it is unlikely that p has five clubs good enough for a vulnerable overcall now that I hold the ace. Then again, holding KQTx-Qx-Qx-KQxxx I think I prefer either 1♠ or 2♣ to dbl although I would probably double playing with someone from BBF.

[the_clown]

If anyone still thinks 3♦ is even a remote possibility please scroll up and read the posts of Phil, Timo and mcphee.

 

I like to think that I am a good and understanding partner, but if the person opposite me bids 3♦ on this I may throw the cards in his face.

 

My scores:

 

1N -10

2N - 6

2♦-5

1♠-4

2♣-2

3NT-1

3♦-1

[ArtK78]

If anyone still thinks 3♦ is even a remote possibility please scroll up and read the posts of Phil, Timo and mcphee.

 

I like to think that I am a good and understanding partner, but if the person opposite me bids 3♦ on this I may throw the cards in his face.

 

My scores:

 

1N -10

2N - 6

2♦-5

1♠-4

2♣-2

3NT-1

3♦-1

 

If you throw the cards in my face, we are going to have a serious problem.

[Aardv]

I think this is quite likely to be a 26-count part score, even opposite Hx of hearts.

 

Therefore 3♦ or 2♥ are too much (if you bid 2♥ you can't drop partner's likely 2♠ bid, and the auction will often wind on to something unmakeable).

 

1NT is sensible if it shows 6-9, as it usually does in the UK. I have an idea that it's played a fair bit stronger in the USA (is it?) which I think would make it less attractive.

 

2♦ is ok too. A Moysian 2♦ should play about as well as a stopperless 1NT. And what hand am I afraid of missing game opposite?

 

However, I am a notorious pessimist.

[eagles123]

1NT is sensible if it shows 6-9, as it usually does in the UK.

 

eh?

[Lovera]

It seems to me that here vary point of views makes bidding free ( or more modern ) but rules are a warrant for success than why don't follow them ?

[yunling]

Interesting comparing this thread with

http://www.bridgebase.com/forums/topic/61568-disater/

:o

[MrAce]

Interesting comparing this thread with

http://www.bridgebas.../61568-disater/

:o

 

Good job Yu. Seems like you busted Aguaman and Hog on the slippery zone.

I think forums are useful more than I think, at least some of us are improving http://www.bridgebase.com/forums/public/style_emoticons/default/tongue.gif (Joke)

[the hog]

Good job Yu. Seems like you busted Aguaman and Hog on the slippery zone.

I think forums are useful more than I think, at least some of us are improving http://www.bridgebase.com/forums/public/style_emoticons/default/tongue.gif (Joke)

 

Yes, I must have learned something over the past year. Perhaps from reading your posts? Nah! More like Justin's. :D

[aguahombre]

Sorry, folks. But, the situations are not quite the same. I would not mind advancing in a suit which is KJ 4th; I do object to a 3-level advance to a 1-bid takeout with j9XX.

 

Also, the theme remains valid that takeout doubler doesn't need to bounce into 3NT without confirming a stop in the Opening suit....in either case.

[the hog]

Sorry, folks. But, the situations are not quite the same. I would not mind advancing in a suit which is KJ 4th; I do object to a 3-level advance to a 1-bid takeout with j9XX.

 

Also, the theme remains valid that takeout doubler doesn't need to bounce into 3NT without confirming a stop in the Opening suit....in either case.

 

Certainly valid arguments agh.

[nige1]

[hv=pc=n&s=sa32hj93dj932ca82&d=s&v=e&b=3&a=p1hdp]133|200|

imps - best bid for south?[/hv]

Using a scoring system where there are no really bad bids,

1NT = 10, 2♠ = 6, 3♦ = 6, 3♠ = 6, 3NT = 6, 2♦ = 3, Pass = 3, , redouble = 3, 1♦ = 3

Also, 2♥ = 2.9

P.S. Additional scores 4NT (Blackwood) = 3, 5♦ = 3

thanks nige1

Accepting the challenge :) 1N = 10, 2♥ = 9, 2♦ = 8, 1♠ = 7, 3♦ = 6, Pass = 3.

Interesting comparing this thread with http://www.bridgebas.../61568-disater/ :o

:) :) :)