opp doubled Stayman

[shnk]

I decided to open 1NT with ♠Qxx ♥AKx ♦AJxxx ♣Kx (I don't remember the pips)

 

1NT - (P) - 2♣ - (X) - ?

 

Partner is an advanced player with whom I have had the privilege of playing with a few times recently.

 

I seem to remember reading somewhere that a pass here shows a club stop and redouble denies. And if I pass redouble by responder re-asks or something. Does that sound about right? What are your meanings for pass, 2D and XX? Should they be alerted?

 

 

 

I decided to pass. He redoubles, I bid 2D and he jumps to 3S so the auction so far is

1NT - (P) - 2♣ - (X)

P - (P) - XX - (P)

2♦ - (P) - 3♠! - (P)

 

Smolen is on our card so I alert it. Opps don't ask for an explanation.

 

Assuming we are on the same page and I've shown a club stop and given I have an absolute max for my opening, should I cuebid clubs or diamonds or just bid 4H? (we cuebid 1st and 2nd round controls equally, but I've already shown my club stopper right?)

 

I bid 4H to protect my half-stopper. Partner tanked and finally rolled out 4NT. I make the 3 keycard response and to my relief, partner bid 6H which was cold

 

 

[SteveMoe]

Try this:

 

Opener's Pass denies ♣ stop.

 

Responder continues:

2♦/♥ crawling/garbage

2♠ Inv

2NT Inv (with stopper)

Redouble repeats Stayman ask (some play this as penalty oriented, using 2♦ to repeat the ask).

3♣ asks/shows partial stop.

3-bids are game forcing and Natural. 3M shows 5 card suit and implies 4-cards in OM. (Right sides contract for lead by doubler).

 

With club stop opener makes normal Stayman response.

With 4 cards in ♣ H10xx or better, opener redoubles.

Responder: Passes for penalties (3+ cards), bids 2♦ crawling and 2M to play. 2N invites. With GF and 4 card Major, responder can bid 3♣ to repeat Stayman call.

 

 

so on this hand I'd bid 2♦ immediately over RHO's double.

[lycier]

I decided to open 1NT with ♠Qxx ♥AKx ♦AJxxx ♣Kx (I don't remember the pips)

 

1NT - (P) - 2♣ - (X) - ?

 

Partner is an advanced player with whom I have had the privilege of playing with a few times recently.

 

I seem to remember reading somewhere that a pass here shows a club stop and redouble denies. And if I pass redouble by responder re-asks or something. Does that sound about right? What are your meanings for pass, 2D and XX? Should they be alerted?

 

 

 

I decided to pass. He redoubles, I bid 2D and he jumps to 3S so the auction so far is

1NT - (P) - 2♣ - (X)

P - (P) - XX - (P)

2♦ - (P) - 3♠! - (P)

 

Smolen is on our card so I alert it. Opps don't ask for an explanation.

 

Assuming we are on the same page and I've shown a club stop and given I have an absolute max for my opening, should I cuebid clubs or diamonds or just bid 4H? (we cuebid 1st and 2nd round controls equally, but I've already shown my club stopper right?)

 

I bid 4H to protect my half-stopper. Partner tanked and finally rolled out 4NT. I make the 3 keycard response and to my relief, partner bid 6H which was cold

 

 

 

 

 

I guess that it is Kansas City Stayman for what you said.Specific content as follows:

 

Kansas City Stayman

1N (P) 2♣ (X)

 

1-Pass = Denies a ♣ stopper.

 

2-Any bid shows a ♣ stopper.

 

3-Responder can XX to ask open tocontinue bidding as normal.

 

4-Any othercall (than XX) by Responder is natural and GF (a major suit bid would show 4cMand imply a ♣ card toprotect --very rare!)

 

 

 

1N(P) 2♣ (X)

 

XX = 5+♣, invites to play 2♣xx.

 

 

 

1N(P) 2♣ (X)

 

2♦=no 4cM, shows a ♣ stopper.

 

 

 

1N(P) 2♣ (X) P (P) 2♠ GF,4+♠, ♣ stopper to protect

 

 

[hv=pc=n&s=sj843h94dak832cj4&w=sa52hjt76dt5ca653&n=s7hq853dj64ckqt82&e=skqt96hak2dq97c97&d=s&v=b&b=7&a=ppp1np2cdpprp2sp2np3sp4sppp]399|300[/hv]

 

This hand came from JEC match,Time:2012-01-18 Beijing Time

West ： sbeatty

North ：georgej

South ：yaohuang

North ：xdongxie

 

 

 

[lowerline]

pass denies a stop

redouble is business (to play 2♣ redoubled)

other bids are as without the double but showing a stop as well

 

after a pass by opener, responder can repeat Stayman by redoubling (or bid 2♦/♥ as weak pass/correct), then opener bids in transfer (2♦ for hearts or 2♥ for spades) so the hand with stop can play.

 

Steven

[kenberg]

As I usually play, the auction on the hand you give would have gone, after the X, as 2♦-Pass-3♠ and then as yours.

 

I have no idea which approach is best for a partnership with detailed agreements but I think of "default pick-up" as being as follows:

 

Passing the X show a willingness to play 2♣X, but not ggreat enthusiasm. maybe KJxx. Partner can XX to play, or bid 2M if he was planning on bidding 2M over my 2♦ had there been no double.

 

An immediate XX shows enthusiasm for playing 2♣XX.

 

People double Stayman far too often and I have had good results with this approach. It also discourages people from doubling simply on KQJx if they know that they may well have to defend 2♣XX.

 

I imagine other systems can be better but this approach is simple. Playing on-line, or anywhere, with someone with whom I have had only general systemic discussion, I think that the default should be that any call that could be natural is natural. Surely there is no standard artificial meaning for a pass, so let it be natural unless it has been discussed.

[y66]

Bridge World Standard (2001) is:

 

After one notrump — (pass) — two clubs — (double) — ?, opener should determine his action by first evaluating his club holding (bid if especially weak, pass if average, redouble if especially strong). [default] { take his normal action had intervenor passed when that action is a major-suit bid (otherwise examine his club holding). [leaf] }

[kenberg]

Bridge World Standard (2001) is:

 

After one notrump — (pass) — two clubs — (double) — ?, opener should determine his action by first evaluating his club holding (bid if especially weak, pass if average, redouble if especially strong). [default] { take his normal action had intervenor passed when that action is a major-suit bid (otherwise examine his club holding). [leaf] }

 

Yes, this seems to be roughly my way of doing it. At least part of the thinking for the consensus BWS system was to get something reasonable that could be a default for capable players in a less than totally dedicated partnership. The description you give of BWS seems to be that pass and XX are natural calls. W/o discussion, this seems right to me. And maybe even with discussion.

[billw55]

People double Stayman far too often and I have had good results with this approach. It also discourages people from doubling simply on KQJx if they know that they may well have to defend 2♣XX.

Agree and I think it is important that both opener and responder be able to redouble to play. RHO has the nerve to enter our strong auction, we must be able to punish him when he has stepped in poo. If we cannot, we are letting ops to get away with too much.

 

Or maybe I just like big numbers too much :P

[wyman]

Agree and I think it is important that both opener and responder be able to redouble to play. RHO has the nerve to enter our strong auction, we must be able to punish him when he has stepped in poo. If we cannot, we are letting ops to get away with too much.

 

Or maybe I just like big numbers too much :P

 

I disagree. I think it's far better to design based around opponents having their bids. The way I figure it, vs teams who are dbling 2C in a situation where responder will want to XX for penalties (and where it will be massively profitable vs our game to do so), we are already winning the match on expectation, so I'd rather figure out the best way to get to the right spot with the lead coming from the correct side vs teams that actually have their bid. I think you win more matches that way.

 

Now we can start talking about meta game: well, if they know that I know that they know that responder cant XX for business, then they can dbl our stayman with a wider range. But I'm not convinced at all that it's necessarily profitable to do so.