Deniro me!

[CSGibson]

[hv=pc=n&s=st7hdkqt964ckqj83&d=s&v=0&b=11&a=1dp2d(limit%20raise%20or%20better)p3h(short%20hearts%2C%20GF)p3sp4h(cheapest%201st%20round%20control)p5n(undiscussed)p7dppp]133|200[/hv]

 

Hi. Any actions you disagree with for the south hand? Obviously South took 5N as grand slam force even though it was undiscussed. Is that reasonable in this auction, or is south off his rocker?

 

Q bidding style is to bid 1st round controls first.

[Fluffy]

I disagre with partner's 5NT, what is the point of 5NT when he can use 4NT which is clearer and leaves more space?

 

I don't see why I'd raise to 7♦ when I Don't know where ♦A lies, just answer 2 honors with 6♥ or 6♠

[aguahombre]

Well, the jump to 5NT ---whether discussed or not--- isn't likely to be pick a slam since there is only one suit in the mix. If it isn't GSF, we need to talk about North's auction, not South's.

 

If it is Josephine, I would have bid 7C with the side supersource of tricks in case 7NT is better. I don't understand Gonzalo's concern. I don't know North's whole hand, but 4NT isn't even Wood in my world and am not sure why he thinks North should do that when he only wants to know about the trumps. We don't use Josephine without holding one of the top 3, so North had better have the Ace to ask the question.

[trevahound]

Could partner think my 3♥ then 4♥ calls were describing some form of 5+♥ 6+♦ hand? Heeeheeeheee. And then partner thought 5nt was pick a slam amongst my reds?

 

Partner said by jumping to 5nt "you can't screw this up, partner". If he was wrong, c'est la vie. I didn't drive all this way (wherever I am) to go plus in 6d like someone from Earth. South has my blessing on all calls.

[nigel_k]

Can 2♦ have a four card major? If not, then he most likely has the black aces and 7♦ is just cold.

 

If it can have a four card major then the most likely explanation for partner bidding 5NT not 4NT is that he has a club void and needs to distinguish the ♣A and ♦K. So I would be worried about something like AKxx QJxx AJxxx -. Which needs some work but looks like a cold grand from his point of view because he thinks our hand is more like Qxx - KQTxxx KQxx. The only fix for that is to not splinter with a pronounced two suiter and just bid 3♣ instead.

[MrAce]

OP says 4♥ was cheapest first round control. Means he already denied minor aces and pd is looking for grandslam since ♦ is obviously the trump. So i also do not understand Gonzalo.

 

Chris, was 3♠ also cheapest first round control ? If so i have an easy grandslam. If not we may be missing ♠ A. But we can learn this.

[CSGibson]

OP says 4♥ was cheapest first round control. Means he already denied minor aces and pd is looking for grandslam since ♦ is obviously the trump. So i also do not understand Gonzalo.

 

Chris, was 3♠ also cheapest first round control ? If so i have an easy grandslam. If not we may be missing ♠ A. But we can learn this.

 

3S is ambiguous - It could be cheapest 1st round control, or it could be a probe for strain at that point (between NT and diamonds). With a singleton heart honor, I suspect I would bid 3N, and get clarity. I think the subsequent 5N, though, clarifies that N had slam interest in mind, so I would expect 1st round control of spades.

[CSGibson]

Can 2♦ have a four card major? If not, then he most likely has the black aces and 7♦ is just cold.

 

 

2♦ ostensibly denies a 4 card major.

 

Systemically, showing a big two suited in diamonds and clubs takes up much more space (requires a 4♣ call), but it was definitely also an option.

[CSGibson]

 

If it is Josephine, I would have bid 7C with the side supersource of tricks in case 7NT is better.

 

I would be concerned that 7♣ would encourage partner to think I showed the singleton ace of hearts instead of a void - I don't want him to think I'm giving a choice of slams in that case.

[sfi]

Surely you would bid 6♥ with the HA as well as two of the top three trumps. There's no ambiguity about it because you're past the agreed trump suit. 7♣ looks perfect on this hand.

[aguahombre]

I would be concerned that 7♣ would encourage partner to think I showed the singleton ace of hearts instead of a void - I don't want him to think I'm giving a choice of slams in that case.

If South is going cooperate with GSF, which he apparently thought it was, he shouldn't be overthinking the answer to it. Conjuring up an obscure meaning for 7C is not productive.

[Fluffy]

OP says 4♥ was cheapest first round control. Means he already denied minor aces and pd is looking for grandslam since ♦ is obviously the trump. So i also do not understand Gonzalo.

I never cuebid the trump suit, and I consider it normal. I would like to hear what others think of this.

 

 

Also I play that to show a void you can bypass other cuebids to avoid partner going to 4NT and having to guess, but this is not what the OP plays.

[the hog]

I disagre with partner's 5NT, what is the point of 5NT when he can use 4NT which is clearer and leaves more space?

doesnt 6M force 7 ds anyway unless you want to play in an unlikely 6nt?

 

I don't see why I'd raise to 7♦ when I Don't know where ♦A lies, just answer 2 honors with 6♥ or 6♠

[Fluffy]

yes, it does, and partner is allowed to have ♦xxxx and ♥AQ, its a small extra chance, but its free.

[ArtK78]

[hv=pc=n&s=st7hdkqt964ckqj83&d=s&v=0&b=11&a=1dp2d(limit%20raise%20or%20better)p3h(short%20hearts%2C%20GF)p3sp4h(cheapest%201st%20round%20control)p5n(undiscussed)p7dppp]133|200[/hv]

 

Hi. Any actions you disagree with for the south hand? Obviously South took 5N as grand slam force even though it was undiscussed. Is that reasonable in this auction, or is south off his rocker?

 

Q bidding style is to bid 1st round controls first.

It is not unreasonable to take 5NT as Grand Slam Force on this auction. Partner has to have solid black suit holdings, long diamonds to the A and 2 or 3 small hearts. A hand like:

 

AKQ xxx Axxxxx A

AK xxx Axxxxxx A

 

or something like that.

 

So, assume that partner is rational and bid 7♦ like you are supposed to (unless you have some other response structure to GSF). Either partner has the hand he is supposed to have or you will have a long discussion about his hand evaluation over dinner.

[CSGibson]

I disagre with partner's 5NT, what is the point of 5NT when he can use 4NT which is clearer and leaves more space?

 

 

From partner's perspective, he doesn't know for sure whether the 4♥ bid is a void or an ace, so the answer to keycard may not be entirely helpful. Granted that the bidding would be extremely aggressive with a Q high suit and a stiff ace as the first round control, but GSF is just a much clearer way of finding out what he wants to know.

[CSGibson]

Here is the actual hand

 

 

[hv=pc=n&s=st7hdkqt964ckqj83&n=sakq5hk5daj83ca62&d=s&v=0&b=11&a=1dp2d(LR+%20in%20diamonds)p3h(splinter)p3sp4hp5n(intended%20as%20pick-a-slam)p7dppp]450|380[/hv]

 

partner always intended on driving to grand after 4♥, but was trying to use 5N as pick-a-slam between diamonds and NT to determine strain. His choice of raising diamonds was based on our opening structure, (we play a weak NT), and led to a much clearer auction than a 1♠ response would have, imo, even though it was anti-systemic.

 

 

 

[mikestar13]

Here is the actual hand

 

 

[hv=pc=n&s=st7hdkqt964ckqj83&n=sakq5hk5daj83ca62&d=s&v=0&b=11&a=1dp2d(LR+%20in%20diamonds)p3h(splinter)p3sp4hp5n(intended%20as%20pick-a-slam)p7dppp]450|380[/hv]

 

partner always intended on driving to grand after 4♥, but was trying to use 5N as pick-a-slam between diamonds and NT to determine strain. His choice of raising diamonds was based on our opening structure, (we play a weak NT), and led to a much clearer auction than a 1♠ response would have, imo, even though it was anti-systemic.

 

 

 

 

You've got 14 tricks, why the h*ll didn't you find the laydown 8♦?:rolleyes:

[sfi]

You've got 14 tricks, why the h*ll didn't you find the laydown 8♦?:rolleyes:

 

Nah - the suicide squeeze kills the contract.

[CSGibson]

You've got 14 tricks, why the h*ll didn't you find the laydown 8♦?:rolleyes:

 

 

Yeah, partner really made the auction easy with his 2♦ bid…This wasn't a results thing so much as partner telling me that no one uses Grand Slam Force anymore, and that I shouldn't have jumped to 7, even though he had me covered.

[MrAce]

Maybe i am old fashioned but ...why did pd not use blackwood ? If 4 NT does not mean blackwood as Aguaman says, then what is after 4♥ ? ♥ void or stiff A can be shown in responses to blackwood, so i do not buy the argumet that he did not use blackwood because he would not know the ♥ holding.

 

5 NT for COS does not sound right to me after inverted minor + splinter. there is something seriously wrong if you can not use blackwood and grandslam force/invitation 5NT at the same time when you choose to cuebid your way to grandslam, Utility of COG 5 NT serves a little purpose in this auction, if any, imho. Here he is at 5 NT, having no clue if you have ♦ A or not, no clue if you have Q of ♦ or not, no clue if you have ♥ A or a void. Looks like he made the right bid for the wrong reason, thank god his pd misunderstood him !

[Fluffy]

I am a bit lost by Chris and Timo's comentaries.

 

After 3♥+4♥ wouldn't we answer 4NT blackwood exactly the same way with ♥A or void?, to clarify:

 

 

♠10x

♥-

♦KQJxxx

♣KQJxx

 

4NT-5♣ (1 keycard) no need to show the void again.

 

 

♠xx

♥A

♦KJxxxx

♣KQxx

 

4NT-5♣ (1 keycard) partner will assume we have void in hearts, showing 2 would land us in grand slam off 1 ace.

 

 

Is what I am saying complicated?

[MrAce]

I am a bit lost by Chris and Timo's comentaries.

 

After 3♥+4♥ wouldn't we answer 4NT blackwood exactly the same way with ♥A or void?, to clarify:

 

 

♠10x

♥-

♦KQJxxx

♣KQJxx

 

4NT-5♣ (1 keycard) no need to show the void again.

 

 

♠xx

♥A

♦KJxxxx

♣KQxx

 

4NT-5♣ (1 keycard) partner will assume we have void in hearts, showing 2 would land us in grand slam off 1 ace.

 

 

Is what I am saying complicated?

 

4 NT--5 NT (even number of keys + a void, obviously heart)

4 NT--6 ♦, odd number of keys + void.

 

So i was basically saying that, if 4♥ did not already show a void, we can go as above. If it already did, there is no need, you go with your regular key responses. Perhaps i am not as good as you guys in cue bidding my way to grandslams and stucked in the past with blackwood. Accidentally i end up in better contracts than those who mastered cuebidding, sue me for being lucky ! http://www.bridgebase.com/forums/public/style_emoticons/default/tongue.gif

 

 

 

[Cyberyeti]

I would have bid 7♣ over 5N to show the ♣QJ.

 

I could have x(x), A, KQ10xxx, Kxxx(x) and this wouldn't matter on partner's actual hand, but is crucial opposite the same hand minus Q♠

[jogs]

Here is the actual hand

 

 

[hv=pc=n&s=st7hdkqt964ckqj83&n=sakq5hk5daj83ca62&d=s&v=0&b=11&a=1dp2d(LR+%20in%20diamonds)p3h(splinter)p3sp4hp5n(intended%20as%20pick-a-slam)p7dppp]450|380[/hv]

 

partner always intended on driving to grand after 4♥, but was trying to use 5N as pick-a-slam between diamonds and NT to determine strain. His choice of raising diamonds was based on our opening structure, (we play a weak NT), and led to a much clearer auction than a 1♠ response would have, imo, even though it was anti-systemic.

 

 

 

 

Can't South be 4432 for his 1♦ opening? Why is North bidding 2♦?