1NT with 4 points?

[AyunuS]

Check this out: http://img843.imageshack.us/img843/6781/widu.png

 

Since when is it good to respond 1NT with 4 points? Shouldn't it just pass? True in this case I made it but still, I had a better than normal hand for what I bid since the singleton club really helped and most of the time a balanced 19 HCP hand would bid a game and not be able to make it here. Also a fewer than 19HCP hand could also get past a bid that it could actually make, too. I have trouble getting the handviewer link thingy to post where you don't have to click it to see the hand so I'm going to try just having the image.

[Stephen Tu]

It's not a random 4 count. It's got an ace, doubleton, support and two tens, it's pretty normal to bid on these sort of things. A fair number of good players believe it's mandatory to respond with an ace. If partner has a hand worthy of jump-shifting, game probably has good chances as it does here. Balanced 19 should typically just raise 1nt to 2nt, which will be passed, it's true this is less desirable than playing 1 heart, but you have to balance these losses vs. making games. Also the vast majority of the time you get back to 2H after a preference, this is hard to balance against, and if 2H goes down one it's likely the opps were going to balance against 1H anyway.

 

More debatable is the use of 1nt as weak raise tactic when a passed hand, perhaps a raise to 2H is better, but I don't know consensus on this.

 

The "six points to respond" thing is something taught to beginners that keeps them out of trouble to some extent, but as you get better you need to learn where to push the boundaries. Also it's "six points", not "six high card points", and this responding hand should evaluate to 5.x something, so close enough.

 

If the hand were a Q and two jacks then I'd be more with your position.

[AyunuS]

You know, that's not that bad of a strategy. I just hadn't thought of bidding 2NT over 1NT response with 19 HCP. Then its 1NT response doesn't seem too bad. It knows it can just always retreat to hearts I guess it can usually stay out of most of the trouble since it's only a little weaker than a normal 2♥ response. Well then this is no big deal.

[manudude03]

Not only is it not a bad strategy, a 2NT rebid shows 18-19 balanced.

[cloa513]

Its more of a fact that GIB responds 1NT when it should be just going for a simple raise- we do a lot of mucking around because of this silly bidding structure- this part of it has no gain.

[manudude03]

Actually, playing constructive raises, you have to bid 1NT with these hands if anything.

[AyunuS]

I agree that if it does want to bid something here, it needs to be 1NT rather than 2♥. 2♥ would lead to at least an invite if opener has 17 or 18 points. 1NT could often escape back to 2♥ if opener responds with 2 of a minor. The 1NT is safer.

[Lovera]

It's not a random 4 count. It's got an ace, doubleton, support and two tens, it's pretty normal to bid on these sort of things. A fair number of good players believe it's mandatory to respond with an ace. If partner has a hand worthy of jump-shifting, game probably has good chances as it does here. Balanced 19 should typically just raise 1nt to 2nt, which will be passed, it's true this is less desirable than playing 1 heart, but you have to balance these losses vs. making games. Also the vast majority of the time you get back to 2H after a preference, this is hard to balance against, and if 2H goes down one it's likely the opps were going to balance against 1H anyway.

 

More debatable is the use of 1nt as weak raise tactic when a passed hand, perhaps a raise to 2H is better, but I don't know consensus on this.

 

The "six points to respond" thing is something taught to beginners that keeps them out of trouble to some extent, but as you get better you need to learn where to push the boundaries. Also it's "six points", not "six high card points", and this responding hand should evaluate to 5.x something, so close enough.

 

If the hand were a Q and two jacks then I'd be more with your position.

Usually 6 points is a "minimum limit" for a safe bidding and to estabilish when with a fewer pointing to pass. But here we have 4 points in high cards + a doubleton that is + 1 p. (Goren valutation for shortness) and more 9 and 10 also. Than partner must bid when has 6 points but having a good raising in the suit of partner can bid also with 5 points that in our case realize a delayed raising that indicates (5)6-8 points at second round reserving to a direct raise(=1♥-2♥) the meaning of 9-11 points.

[johnu]

Not bad Lovera. Another thread brought back from the dead but at least this one is less than 2 years old.

[Lovera]

Not bad Lovera. Another thread brought back from the dead but at least this one is less than 2 years old.

This way to do is allow (as also barmar and helene_t had to say in Old Topics) until anyone has anything to adjuntive or to re-fine at. I forthemore see often Last click at the aim to go around for all BBO posts/topics that usually can not to be "youngs",bye.