How to play this?

[Riverida]

Contract 6♥, South plays.

West leads 5♠,East takes with As♠and returns 7♠ [hv=pc=n&s=skj6haqt643d8cqj9&n=sqt9hk9daj64cak73]133|200[/hv]

[Endymion77]

Hope that you won't get ruffed at trick 2 and you'll be able to draw trump? I don't really understand this problem.

[Fluffy]

maximize your entries means winning ♠K, and ruffing a diamonds before playing ♥A+♥K.

 

We need RHO to have 3 clubs, but not 3 spades, it is important to reach this ending to avoid that:

[hv=pc=n&s=sjhqtdc9&w=shdc&n=sqhdjcak&e=shj8dc6]399|300[/hv]

 

Regardless of East's last card being a club, diamond or spade he is defenseless.

 

 

EDIT: all of this problem is obviously about East holding 4 hearts including the jack.

[TylerE]

Fluffy, I don't understand.

 

We've already lost one trick (A♠), so we can't lose another trick ever anyways. Given that, we have 2♠ + 6♥ + 1♦ + 4♣ = 13 tricks. Why do we need to ruff a ♦ ever? I suspect what this comes down to is wether you just bang down top trumps or somehow hope to deduce E has Jxxx(x).

[PhilKing]

Fluffy, I don't understand.

 

We've already lost one trick (A♠), so we can't lose another trick ever anyways. Given that, we have 2♠ + 6♥ + 1♦ + 4♣ = 13 tricks. Why do we need to ruff a ♦ ever? I suspect what this comes down to is wether you just bang down top trumps or somehow hope to deduce E has Jxxx(x).

 

Because West holds:

 

♠85432

♥x

♦Hxxxx

♣xx

 

The standard preliminaries set the stage and cost nothing.

[TylerE]

I'm still failing to see how that helps you

[gnasher]

I thought the problem was how to cater for both 2=4=3=4 and 4=4=2=3, but I can't think of a way to do that other than the old-fashioned method of seeing what spade spots they play and then asking about their carding.

[gnasher]

I'm still failing to see how that helps you

You play ♠K, ♦A, ♦ ruff, ♥A-K (West showing out), ♦ ruff, four rounds of clubs.

 

Or if you think East is 4=4=2=3, you play ♠K, ♦A, ♦ ruff, ♥A-K (West showing out), three rounds of clubs, ♦ ruff, spade, club.

Edited September 25, 2013 by gnasher

[mikeh]

Fluffy, I don't understand.

 

We've already lost one trick (A♠), so we can't lose another trick ever anyways. Given that, we have 2♠ + 6♥ + 1♦ + 4♣ = 13 tricks. Why do we need to ruff a ♦ ever? I suspect what this comes down to is wether you just bang down top trumps or somehow hope to deduce E has Jxxx(x).

This is a classic example of expert technique.

 

We can all see that if trumps behave, we pull trump and claim.

 

The expert goes a bit further, at trick 1 or, in this case, 2. He asks what can I do about a bad trump break?

 

5-0, the answer is 'nothing'.

 

Jxxx behind me, again the answer is 'nothing'.

 

But Jxxx onside...we can pick this up but only if we can arrange to be in dummy leading a meaningless card with Q10 in hand and RHO Jx, in the 2 card end position.

 

We cannot accomplish this unless we get our trump length down to the same as RHO's. We have 6 trump, he has, we assume, 4. That means we need to ruff twice, early on, and we don't have a lot of entries, especially since we need to get to dummy in the 3 card end position.

 

Therefore, we ruff a diamond as soon as possible.

 

Note that the chances of being over-ruffed are far less than the chances of the 4-1 trump break that we are guarding against. Note also that we aren't giving up on the good trump breaks.

 

This sort of hand in one of those on which, if you are watching, you can tell immediately if declarer is an expert. All experts would, unless drunk or half-asleep, ruff a diamond right away.

 

Of course, these hands don't always work out even when we find the Jxxx onside, since we need to be able to cash all of our side winners without him ruffing.

 

The more advanced versions of this hand type require declarer to shorten his trump by ruffing winners :D Those are more difficult to recognize because, when we count our tricks, we tend to count those winners, when in fact we should treat them as losers to be ruffed.

[TylerE]

But playing it like that aren't you going down whenever RHO has a black doubleton?

[PhilKing]

But playing it like that aren't you going down whenever RHO has a black doubleton?

 

Tricks 1-2: given

3: ♦A

4: ♦ruff

5-6: two trumps ending in dummy

 

The key thing at this stage is to notice if anyone has shown out. Let's assume West does.

 

7: ♦ruff

8-10: cash three ♣, ending in dummy.

 

We now need East to follow to (at least) three clubs, but not three spades. This brings us to an ending one card beyond that described by Fluffy.

 

11: Lead a winning club. East can't profitably ruff this, so we pitch our spade and coup him at trick 12.

 

If East has the guarded jack, we succeed when he is 2443 2434 or 3433 3424, so the play is not just for show.

[mikeh]

But playing it like that aren't you going down whenever RHO has a black doubleton?

Why?

 

A♦, ruff a diamond. A trump, trump to the King. If trump are 3-2 or the stiff Jack, we return to hand with a club and pull trump and claim.

 

We only ruff the 2nd diamond if LHO shows out on the 2nd trump. Now we are down to the correct trump length and need some help from RHO in terms of our being able to cash enough black winners. Note that we'd tackle clubs first, because we need clubs 3-3 anyway, and if RHO has 4 of them, we can pitch our last spade on the 4th round, winning when he is 2=4 blacks, while if clubs are 3-3, we need him to be 3-3 or 4-3 blacks.

 

This hand is a very good topic....once you grasp the thinking needed to visualize what you are trying to do, that skill will help you in many other situations. Good declarer play (and defence for that matter) is usually all about visualizing how the cards may lie. I learned squeeze technique by reading Love's book many, many years ago, and while it is a great book, it focused too much on 'rules', rather than on learning visualization... this kind of thread is far better, imo, than simply setting out rules. For example, to understand this hand, you also need to think about transportation and timing. Our gut instinct with AQ10xxx opposite Kx is low to the K and back to the AQ, but that is an error on this hand.

 

I note Philking gave a shorter, but just as accurate answer....I am not trying to detract from his, but hope that the longer explanation is of use.

[PhilKing]

The more advanced versions of this hand type require declarer to shorten his trump by ruffing winners :D Those are more difficult to recognize because, when we count our tricks, we tend to count those winners, when in fact we should treat them as losers to be ruffed.

 

Try this one:[hv=pc=n&s=skt4hakqt8753dc42&n=saj65hdkt953cak76&d=n&v=0&b=1&a=1dp2hp2sp3hp4cp4sp5ddrp5sp7hppp]266|200[/hv]

 

West leads the ♦2, you play the ten and East plays low.

 

I think it's fair to say there are a few layers to this hand.

[gszes]

Read the LOP posted by Fluffy Mikeh and PhilKing they are hugely instructive when it

comes to the proper technique for IMAGINING an end position and looking at your

overall entry situation and seeing if early action is needed to achieve the desired

end position. Gnasher also points out a similar idea and automatically ruffs a dia

early with no discussion as to why in preparation to playing rho for either

4423 or 2434 distribution.

 

My only concern is that no one thinks it is possible for rho to hold 5413 distribution.

This is a position that is possible given the defense so far and since we were not shown

the bidding or lho 2nd spade card we have no reason to dismiss this situation out of

hand. It is only after trying to see if it is plausible to make the hand (without guessing to

arbitrarily take a heart hook) and realizing it is not that one embarks on the suggested

LOP of ruffing a dia early to shorten our trumps just in case rho began with 4 hearts to

the J. If declarer immediately shortens diamonds without a moments thought get out of

that game as soon as possible because they think entirely too fast for you (and

especially for me).

[Fluffy]

Try this one:[hv=pc=n&s=skt4hakqt8753dc42&n=saj65hdkt953cak76&d=n&v=0&b=1&a=1dp2hp2sp3hp4cp4sp5ddrp5sp7hppp]266|200[/hv]

 

West leads the ♦2, you play the ten and East plays low.

 

I think it's fair to say there are a few layers to this hand.

I don't see the 100% line if I ruff, even if I had exact count in diamonds, so this is like a mindgame. I am ruffing anyway as I don't think there are many players with a twisted mind capable of failing to cover with AJxxx without ♥Jxxx, the play is easy if hearts are 1-4. 3-2 makes it harder.

[nige1]

[hv=pc=n&s=skt4hakqt8753dc42&n=saj65hdkt953cak76&d=n&v=0&b=1&a=1dp2hp2sp3hp4cp4sp5ddrp5sp7hppp]266|200|

West leads the ♦2, you play the ten and East plays low. I think it's fair to say there are a few layers to this hand.

[/hv]

Win ♦T chucking ♠K. Ruff a ♦ with ♥7. Cash ♥AK.

If you discover RHO started with ♥Jxxx, then you hope RHO has at least a doubleton in both black suits ...

Finesse ♠J. Ruff a ♦. Cross to ♠A. Ruff a ♦. Cross to ♣K. Ruff a ♦.

At trick 11, enter dummy with ♣A to over-ruff RHO.

A trap is to discard a small ♠, because, when you lead a ♠ towards dummy, your brilliant LHO will rise with ♠Q to block the suit.

If RHO has seven ♦ or singleton ♠Q, then you might have done better to ruff the 1st trick :)

... Although, if he also has four ♥, then you couldn't have made the contract anyway.

... But if he has neither four ♥ nor a guarded ♠Q , then congratulate him on his cunning defence :(

 

[nige1]

[hv=pc=n&s=sajt876542hdc5432&w=skq9had76543ckj97&n=s3hdakqjt98caqt86&e=shkqjt98765432d2c&d=n&v=b&b=13&a=1d6h6sdppp]399|300|

An old double-dummy problem of mine,

with a similar theme.

 

South to make 6♠

after West leads ♥A.[/hv]

[gnasher]

My only concern is that no one thinks it is possible for rho to hold 5413 distribution.

Or perhaps nobody cares. How do you propose to make against that distribution?

[PhilKing]

Nige1 = 10

 

Very good. Nigel's spoiler contains the "correct" answer, but there is another twist.

[rhm]

Very good. Nigel's spoiler contains the "correct" answer, but there is another twist.

There may be as many twists as you like, but I consider it double dummy nonsense.

In a par contest four robots might consider playing like that

 

Rainer Herrmann

[PhilKing]

An old double-dummy problem of mine,

with a similar theme.

 

South to make 6♠

after West leads ♥A.[/hv]

 

Yep lol trick 1.

[WellSpyder]

Yep lol trick 1.

What simpler way to reduce your trumps than to throw one away?

[gszes]

Or perhaps nobody cares. How do you propose to make against that distribution?

 

tis a shame u didnt finish reading the whole post sigh i read yours:)))))))

 

 

 

[gnasher]

tis a shame u didnt finish reading the whole post

Sorry.

 

Mind you, even if it were possible to make against that distribution, I still wouldn't spend very long thinking about it, because 2173 opposite 5413 is a priori very unlikely, more unlikely given that West apparently never bid, and even less likely now that LHO has led a spade rather than a damond.

[Riverida]

[hv=pc=n&s=sajt876542hdc5432&w=skq9had76543ckj97&n=s3hdakqjt98caqt86&e=shkqjt98765432d2c&d=n&v=b&b=13&a=1d6h6sdppp]399|300|

An old double-dummy problem of mine,

with a similar theme.

 

South to make 6♠

after West leads ♥A.[/hv]

Ruff ♥A from dummy and underruff from hand. Then ruff diamonds and play clubs.Arrived to last three trumps play 10.