New minor forcing - auction gone wrong

[losercover]

http://i85.photobucket.com/albums/k53/mikidog/hand_zpscaecf457.jpg

 

practicing against robots

 

1d - 1s

2nt - 3c

3n - 4h

4s (asked partner what she had in hearts 6h

 

My understanding is that after 3c, partner's obligation is so show spade support first and then 4h. Partner insists that her call was correct and 3N shows hearts.

She took 4h as a cue bid and cue bid 4s. My interpretation was that 4s was what the?

 

I could have bid 4H over 2NT but thought my hand was too good with the club void.

[TylerE]

This is not an appropriate hand to bid NMF on. Don't torture partner. Just bid 3♥ over 2N...

 

PS: For many people this is never ever ever NMF, but instead a Wolff Signoff or Checkback Stayman or....

[trevahound]

http://i85.photobucket.com/albums/k53/mikidog/hand_zpscaecf457.jpg

 

practicing against robots

 

1d - 1s

2nt - 3c

3n - 4h

4s (asked partner what she had in hearts 6h

 

My understanding is that after 3c, partner's obligation is so show spade support first and then 4h. Partner insists that her call was correct and 3N shows hearts.

She took 4h as a cue bid and cue bid 4s. My interpretation was that 4s was what the?

 

I could have bid 4H over 2NT but thought my hand was too good with the club void.

 

Where I come from, you always show the other major (4cM) before 3 card support for partner's major. You'll know if partner signs off in 3nt after your OM response that he/she was looking for 3 card support, and can bid it then. Your way round, I don't see how you can ever find your 4/4 OM fits when you have a 3/5 M suit fit, as you certainly can't rebid 4OM after 3nt "just in case". I don't know where this idea of burying your 4/4 OM fit comes from, but I hear it surprisingly often.

 

In general, though, I'm a huge fan of transfers over 2nt power rebids. Look at it this way: you play transfers over your str NT openings, and your 2nt openings, and your 2c then 2nt openings -- why on earth not over this one very strong in between range?

 

Cheers,

 

Brian Zaugg

[jogs]

Didn't you forget an opening pass by South?

The way I play it, nmf mostly applies after 1NT forcing.

It also semi-implies 5332 pattern. With 5-4 in the majors

bid 1m-1S, 1NT-2H.

[aguahombre]

Didn't you forget an opening pass by South?

The way I play it, nmf mostly applies after 1NT forcing.

It also semi-implies 5332 pattern. With 5-4 in the majors

bid 1m-1S, 1NT-2H.

HUH?

NMF applies after a 1NT rebid, not 1NT forcing.

NMF stands for new minor, not new major..so it does not imply 5-3-3-2 pattern.

 

In any case, the folks who suggested not screwing around after the 2NT rebid and just bidding 3H were correct.

[barmar]

When you have enough points for game, 4-4 fits often play about a trick better than 5-3 fits, because you can take ruffs in both hands, and use the long suit for pitches. The exception is when the trump suit breaks badly, since a long suit can deal with this better, but it's not generally possible to find this out during the auction (if the opponents are preempting, bad breaks are more likely.

 

Even so, the style that many people play is that opener should bid the cheaper of the major or the other major. This is mainly used over 1NT, because there's plenty of room to find a fit in the other major. Also, if opener doesn't have enough strength to accept a game invitation, the 5-3 may play better.

[P_Marlowe]

Assuming standard agreement set, 3NT denies anything worth while to say, i.e. it denies

 

#1 3 spades

#2 4 hearts

#3 5 diamonds

 

=> hence 3NT is showing a 4432 hand.

3NT is a very descriptive bid, but does not show hearts, to show hearts, you can bid hearts.

 

4H after 3NT, is most likley showing 55 in the majors with some SI,

hence 4S is a cue, showing concentrated values in the majors, and also Ace / King combinations

in the minors.

 

You could have bid 4H direct with 55, without SI.

 

Going via the delayed route, is also stronger than going via a direct 3H bid, assuming 3H to be

forcing, but if you just play 3C as NMF, than 3H can be played as NF.

 

With kind regards

Marlowe

[Free]

3NT denies all sorts of things, so it's clearly wrong. However, using NMF on this hand is also wrong when you could as easily have shown your hand by bidding 3♥ or 4♥.