helium Posted January 14, 2005 Report Share Posted January 14, 2005 Hi all I Had a puzzling experience the other day at my local club and wonder what you think abouth this. we were playing a 30 boards turney, and opps were "friends from the local club" last deal of 3 agains this pair my p open 4 ♠ and all passed. and when there is 5 cards left p is in DUmmy and play the 8 of club. [hv=n=s10hdxxc862&w=shdxxxxc4&e=shdxck1075&s=sxhdcaqj9]399|300|[/hv] opps follow whit the 10 p play the Q and lho the 4. now p sit for a minnutt and think berfore he say: "uff i whish i had one more entry to the dummy" opps laugh and and p think for 15-20 more sec before he say: "AH well, small club" i took the card from dummy and rho play small p the jack and lho a d, now p play spade to dummy and take the club finness one more time.12 tricks .and a 100%score-. when we got to the smoke room my p sayd: Did u see that? yes i sayd, you were on your hand when u played a card from dummy!yes he sayd. he was just trying to make a joke when he called for the club from dummy, since everyone (after the "whis i had one more entry") know hes not in dummy.But when both opps followed whitout a word he dint tell them it was a joke but played as nothing irregular had happend. this episode bothered me a bit, isnt this same as cheating?i had really bad concens afterwors and felt i had to tell my opps whhat my p did.(i did and they just laughted, they are friends of my p)And they dint have a clue before i told them what happend. so my question is: is this cheating? are there any rules abouth this ? kenneth Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
yapuka Posted January 14, 2005 Report Share Posted January 14, 2005 Hello, There is an entry to the table. :) You are right to be troubled though: this "joke" affected the score of very other player in the room. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
inquiry Posted January 14, 2005 Report Share Posted January 14, 2005 It is the responsibilty of your opponents to catch the infraction of lead from the wrong hand...and once EAST follows suit the lead is "Accepted"...but there are a number of issues here... 1) As dummy you could try to warn parnter that he is about to lead from the wrong hand (according to law 42), but I have never figured out how as dummy you know your partner is about to blurt out a card from dummy until after he does it. As dummy, once an infraction occurs, you are not allowed to point it out until the hand is over I beleive. But there is a law that covers what your partner did. He admitted that he intentionally called for a card from dummy when he knew the lead was in his hand. That is, it was not inadvertent. This is a SERIOUS violation of the proprieties and the laws. There are several places where such action is directly against the rules, for instance, it is clearly stated in the laws of bridge that a player must not infringe a law intentionally. Where you usually see this law discussed is where you revoke once, and later when the suit is lead again, you discover the card you revoked with... Here you are not suppose to revoke again ( to hide the first infaction), nor at the end of the hand, concede the remaining tricks by sticking your hand into the board without exposing the cards. You have no obligation to point out the first infraction but you are not allowed to intentionally repeat the infraction. Here decelarer's joke was a clear and intnetional infraction of the rules. Ethically, he should report himself. If it was unintentional, it is not his responsibility. The director would adjust the score, not because EW should have protected themselves (who knows, the director may let their score stand), but because your partner should not profit from his intential violates of the rules. And once your partner told you the story, you should have reported it to the director and had the score corrected as well... Ben Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
guggie Posted January 14, 2005 Report Share Posted January 14, 2005 Am I missing something? Where is the third club in dummy? With 2 clubs in dummy he can only make 2 finesses imho Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
helium Posted January 14, 2005 Author Report Share Posted January 14, 2005 Am I missing something? Where is the third club in dummy? With 2 clubs in dummy he can only make 2 finesses imho yes you are right my foult but this was just to illustrate the point.the cards dosent matter. he was on the hand when he called a card from dummy. kenneth Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
helium Posted January 14, 2005 Author Report Share Posted January 14, 2005 i have fixed it so dummy have 3 clubs now. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
guggie Posted January 14, 2005 Report Share Posted January 14, 2005 OK if it was serious tournament with real money prizes adjustments sh be made, if not so a drink for every player present would do the trick. And never yield to temptation anymore... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fluffy Posted January 14, 2005 Report Share Posted January 14, 2005 This thing is not allowed, you cannot infringe a law intentionally, thre are many situations where doing so you have nothing to lose and something to win, a quick example may be making a revoke to try to get a trrick when you know all tricks are for declarer, if you get caught doing this intentionally you should be sent out of the tourney. On the other hand there is a famous one from the 70's or 60's (I wasn't even born by then) who was known for not following the rules much, he were playing with a very correct partner, and he faced an entrry problem very very similar to that one, he though for a while, then asked a card from dummy, dummy said: no sorry you are in your hand. And he continueud thinking, after another while he retried with another one from dummy, and partner pointed again that he was at his own hand. So after another while he asked his partner if che could go and bring him a coffee, his partner left, and then he played the card by himself, and made an imopsible contract. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
han Posted January 14, 2005 Report Share Posted January 14, 2005 On the other hand there is a famous one from the 70's or 60's (I wasn't even born by then) who was known for not following the rules much, he were playing with a very correct partner, and he faced an entrry problem very very similar to that one, he though for a while, then asked a card from dummy, dummy said: no sorry you are in your hand. And he continueud thinking, after another while he retried with another one from dummy, and partner pointed again that he was at his own hand. So after another while he asked his partner if che could go and bring him a coffee, his partner left, and then he played the card by himself, and made an imopsible contract. LOL, very funny. I agree with the other posters that this unacceptable behavoir by your partner. I understand the joke (though I wouldn't make it), but when RHO follows, your partner should have admitted the joke, and turned the cards back. Even if your partner and his friends think that this is not a serious game, there may be other people in the room that take the game more seriously. Their scores are also affected by this, so the score should be changed. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gerardo Posted January 14, 2005 Report Share Posted January 14, 2005 Kenneth: Have a good laugh with partner and opps, then call the director. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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