Shoot West, East, or do they deserve each other?

[TylerE]

[hv=pc=n&w=sak6haqj9765d5c54&e=sj932h2daq964caq6&d=w&v=n&b=12&a=1hp1sp4hp6nppp]266|200|IMPs[/hv]

 

Last board of a 12 hand IMP set, you're doing ok, but not good. Right around average through the first 10 boards.

 

Hearts were onside, but KTxx, so the slam didn't come in.

[mike777]

my take is neither pard trusted the other pard if they pulled back in their choices.

 

blame both.

[inquiry]

I blame East, but I will never resort to violence (like shooting or even yelling at him).

 

What does 1♥-1♠-4♥ show (or should it show)?

 

For me it shows a very good suit (check), around a king more than a normal opener (check), and something like 4 and a half losers (check).

 

So to me West described his hand perfectly. Six hearts on this bidding (from East point of view) could be laydown, with 6NT off a ton of spade tricks (do you see a slam notrump stopper In East's hand? I do not either, so we can never approve of his jump to 6NT.

 

I think, with a singleton with East, I would probably pass this bid (given we have around 16 opposite 13 and I lack real heart support). But if I was to continue, I would bid 5♣ as a cue bid, and then over partner' 5♦ cue-bid (which would promise a spade control), rebid 5♥ leaving the decision up to partner.

 

BTW, 4♥ should set trumps, and if you have a polished partnership, 4♠ probably should be keycard blackwood and 4NT a spade cue-bid. But reversing those two bids doesn't have an effect here.

 

 

To me, WEST is 100% blameless.. .but then, maybe not everyone plays the jump to 4♥'s like I do.

[mike777]

if west bid 100% perfect agree blame east

 

 

if not.

[aguahombre]

I am not familiar with Canape 1/1 G.F. where the worst feature of the hand is shown first. But, since that apparently is their system, the 4H rebid seems just right. East, having taken the effort to describe his hand perfectly up to that point, should pass.

[mr1303]

Excellent point by aguahombre - why on Earth is East bidding 1S rather than 2d?

 

6NT is equally off this planet.

[rhm]

Preempts work, also against your partner.

However, the real culprit is the 1♠ response.

I do not understand this bid. It is the type of bid players make, who do not want to involve their partner. The jump to slam pales in comparison.

So much better to show a strong hand and show where you live.

Opener would have had no reason to preempt over 2♦, which likely would have hurt his side more.

When the bidding eventually reaches 4♥, East will not sit there and wonder how many undisclosed values he got.

 

Rainer Herrmann

[Fluffy]

I Agree with Ben, west made no mistake.

[EricK]

I would shoot east because of his 1♠ bid. Because of the 6NT bid, I wouldn't call an ambulance afterwards.

[uhhlv]

I think east made to big failures. The 1Sp bid is very bad and the 6 NT is criminal. There s so much bidding room. Why does he jump to 6 NT?

 

East´s 4H bid is ok. But with 3 spades after the 1Sp bid it is not my first choice. After the 4 heart jump you ve no chance to find a possible spade contract.

 

 

But it is not so easy to find a better bid instead of 4H.

[P_Marlowe]

Hi,

 

#1 West 4H is ok, if they dont have a bid to show gameforcing single suiter, 4H is sensible.

The 1S response was nice given, that West holds AKx, he can expect help in spades.

#2 6NT I dont understand, if he wants to bid slam, he should bid 6H, or 4NT.

 

I did not look to closely in East bidding, 2D is certainly better than 1S, but it is not

the worst crime / decision.

 

With kind regards

Marlowe

[aguahombre]

The 1S bid is the precipitating move. Since it didn't show much strength, West chose the heart jump; then East who had undisclosed extra strength felt obligated to do something more with little room to operate.

 

This pair might still have screwed up a bit more slowly after a strength-showing 2/1 response; but it wouldn't have been the given auction.

[P_Marlowe]

The 1S bid is the precipitating move. Since it didn't show much strength, West chose the heart jump; then East who had undisclosed extra strength felt obligated to do something more with little room to operate.

 

This pair might still have screwed up a bit more slowly after a strength-showing 2/1 response; but it wouldn't have been the given auction.

Sure, ..., but the 1S bid could also have beend the winner bid.

It keeps the auction low, lets opener describe his hand more easily, searches for our most likely 8 card major fit.

Of course it also will prevent responder from ever describing his 54 shape, something I consider a lot more problematic,

than the the temporary hiding of strength, because 1S does not deny gameforcing, usually I will be able to show the strength

I hold.

 

With kind regards

Marlowe

[Hanoi5]

East is to blame. I wonder what happened on the eleventh hand.

[Codo]

Nobody deserves a partner like East, but West comes close to it.

4 ♥ is silly. With a possible AK6 support in spades, why did he choose 4 ♥? He deserves to play a 7/0 Fit instead of a 6/3 fit.

But anyway, with a sane partner he had not been there, because a sane partner had not bid 1 ♠.

[billw55]

Nobody deserves a partner like East, but West comes close to it.

4 ♥ is silly. With a possible AK6 support in spades, why did he choose 4 ♥? He deserves to play a 7/0 Fit instead of a 6/3 fit.

Possibly an interesting point, but you don't say what rebid you do suggest for west. A spade raise? To what level?

[gszes]

Given the 1s bid by E, W has a terrific rebid problem. 4H is a very

reasonable call though I might have chosen the more cowardly 3h.

The real problems are system and misusing system. In this case

2d to show power rather than showing a cruddy 4 card suit with AQ

in both minors would have helped this pair achieve a much better

result. The direct jump to small slam with a singleton in p suit also

seems to be lacking a sense of direction. While 4h should show a

pretty decent suit there is little to suppot the idea this has to be a 1

loser suit and opposite a singleton that is pretty much what you need

especially if missing a key card (which was not checked).

 

E 100% W maybe a tad due to IMO slight overbid of 4h.

 

 

[neilkaz]

West doesn't deserve East's very poor bidding. Why not 2♦ instead of 1♠ and 6NT is a bad gamble.

[WellSpyder]

Nobody deserves a partner like East, but West comes close to it.

4 ♥ is silly. With a possible AK6 support in spades, why did he choose 4 ♥? He deserves to play a 7/0 Fit instead of a 6/3 fit.

But anyway, with a sane partner he had not been there, because a sane partner had not bid 1 ♠.

I thought it was quite normal to play this sort of jump as showing something of a spade fit. How else can you now have a hand worth game when it wasn't worth a stronger opening bid? (But I agree 100% that starting with 1♠ on the East hand is a poor idea.)

[aguahombre]

Well, Wellspyder: I believe there are a lot of hands which would open a 1-bid where the partnership should be in game merely because you now know responder has a response --- even balanced ones---so I don't believe the inference about spade cards is valid.

 

Nor do I believe that inference or treatment matters here.

[gnasher]

I thought it was quite normal to play this sort of jump as showing something of a spade fit. How else can you now have a hand worth game when it wasn't worth a stronger opening bid?

I've only ever heard that argued in a context where opener had a strong but not game-forcing two-bid available, such as in Acol or SEF.

 

What would you do with xx AKJ9xxx x AKx ?

[WellSpyder]

I've only ever heard that argued in a context where opener had a strong but not game-forcing two-bid available, such as in Acol or SEF.

I don't think I noticed a system specified in the OP, but I agree with you - if the only alternative to a one-level opening is a game force then you can't use the argument I mentioned. (I play a sort of strong club system more often tna anything else these days, and it certainly seems a reasonable approach then.)