5M over partner's premptive

Flame · December 16, 2004

What are those 5 level mean ?

partner opens 2H premptive and you raize to 5H

1. RHO pass

2. RHO doube

3. RHO 3C

would you play any diffenret had partner's 2H was H+S prement ?

inquiry · December 16, 2004

2♥-(Pass)-5♥ = bid slam with good hearts

2♥-(DBL)-5♥ = preemptive

2♥-(3♣)-5♥ = bid slam with club control

I don't play 2♥ as spade/heart preempt, so haven't thought about it

Flame · December 16, 2004

i thought those are all premptives, and was sure that over 3c since i have a cue bid to show a good hand 5H would be a prempt.

shanbari · December 16, 2004

it's all preempty bid by me, as long as i found 11 or 12 heart fit, following law of tatal tricks. then if i had strong hand to invite slam, i always start with 2NT or new suit forcing.

shan

inquiry · December 16, 2004

i thought those are all premptives, and was sure that over 3c since i have a cue bid to show a good hand 5H would be a prempt.

Your method is very common, and works if you have discussed this with your partner. As always, it is good to have agreements with your partner. :-) Without such a disucssion, I would assume regular leap to five of a major rules apply.

In general, a voluntary bid of 5 in a major suit is a slam invitation. So your focus is on what kind of hand would the slam invitation be made on. However, with some partners I play that if our side has made a weak bid (preempt), the jump to five is always preemptive (after a preempt, the preempter's jump to five is always preemptive, regardless if you play this rule...but then maybe he made a mistake not bidding more to begin with).

Ben

mikestar · December 16, 2004

Treating all of these a preemptive makes the most sense (given partnership agreement). In the 2H-(P)-5H case, which is more likely:

1) We've got a slam if partner has good trumps.

2) They can make 4S and are fairly sure to bid it (5H bidder has a spade void and five little hearts).

I'm sure #2 is more likely. And #1 can be handled via RKCB or Exclusion RKCB with a void. (And with two voids you are going to blast to 6 or 7 anyway, aren't you?)

The frequency edge is even greater in favor of #2 when opponent bids or doubles, showing some values.

inquiry · December 16, 2004

Just to give you a feel for how the "average" BBO player uses the 2H-PASS-5H auctions I have provided all the hands that started 2H-PASS-5H during the months of october and november 2004 on the BBO (main room only). There were only 23 such hands and the jump to 5♥ was twice as likely to be on a strong hand than a weak hand.

BTW, I disagree with almost all the jumps to 5♥ played as a strong hand, as almost all of them were inappropriate even if you played the jump as slam invite looking for good trumps. This was for infomational purposes. Also, thee were mamny more people leaping to 5♥ on the strong hands below than there were leaping to 5H on the weak ones... so these "odds" are actually not the accurate ones... Some of the 5♥ preemptive bids were over the top too... but at least when you bid 5H as weak. that ends your particpation.

[hv=d=n&v=n&n=saqt7ht8dt983ckq8&w=s982hakdaq54cat95&e=sk54hq96532djcj72&s=sj63hj74dk762c643]399|300|Scoring: IMP

SLAM TRY 1 WEAK O[/hv][hv=d=n&v=n&n=saqt7ht8dt983ckq8&w=s982hakdaq54cat95&e=sk54hq96532djcj72&s=sj63hj74dk762c643]399|300|Scoring: IMP

SLAM TRY 1 WEAK O[/hv]

[hv=d=n&v=n&n=saqt7ht8dt983ckq8&w=s982hakdaq54cat95&e=sk54hq96532djcj72&s=sj63hj74dk762c643]399|300|Scoring: IMP

SLAM TRY 1 WEAK O[/hv]

han · December 16, 2004

In most of the slam-tries, the bid is vague and partner is left guessing what is required to bid slam. A combination of 1) Ogusts or the like 2) keycards 3) exclusion RKC and 4) control asking jump shifts would do a better job.

I play the jumps to the 5-level as preemptive when discussed.

Rebound · December 16, 2004

i admit i only scanned the first few hands, but in each case, it seemed the jump to 5 left partner with a pretty damned ugly decision, as hannie pointed out. Many of them provide examples of why I like to play RONF.

beatrix45 · December 30, 2004

With the big hand what's the rush? Why not start with 2NT (forcing)? But, once in a while the LAW does dictate an eleven trick major suit bid ASAP, so make it so.

bearmum · December 30, 2004

As my reg p in f2f and another weekly partner online (playing different systems I might add) BOTH play RONF over weak 2 Majors in ALL cases I would play the 2M 5M jump as PURELY premptive

With a possible slam hand there must be several ways to discover partner's range and strength :rolleyes:

firechief · January 10, 2005

Probably the best method is to play all the 5h jumps are preemptive. However, if I were playing rubber bridge with a random partner, I wouldn't bid 5h preemptive w/o the opponents entering the auction.

Joel

5M over partner's premptive

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