JLOGIC Posted January 10, 2013 Report Share Posted January 10, 2013 I am going to take a punt and guess that you are 24 years old. Funniest post ever (altho I'm 26 so you might be making fun of me itt also :P) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lord Molyb Posted January 10, 2013 Report Share Posted January 10, 2013 I'm much younger than 24 :unsure: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gnasher Posted January 11, 2013 Report Share Posted January 11, 2013 I shouldn't have said negative double, was a poor use of the term. I should have said that I play it as a "values, it's our hand but I don't have a clear cut action", double. Not A penalty double but if you want to I can cope. Whereas the definition of a take out double is, I do not want to play in this contract, please bid something else. Now that can be converted into a penalty but you need some reason, you fear a misfit, you have trump tricks, your hand is defensive not offensive ie few quick tricks. This hand IMO is not a penalty pass, thus I bid 5♥I think that a "takeout double" at the five level shows a hand where you would have made a takeout double at the three- or four-level and been happy to have it taken out into a game contract. I don't think there is any hand that could say "I do not want to play in this contract, please bid something else" and simultaneously "I'm happy for you to bid five of any of the other three suits on K10532." Your definition may be more consistent linguistically, but it also means that a five-level takeout double doesn't exist. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vampyr Posted January 11, 2013 Report Share Posted January 11, 2013 So, in current popular usage, the term "negative double" is reserved for the double made by the partner of the opening bidder after intervention. But the fact is that negative doubles are any doubles that are not positive (i.e. penalty) doubles. I guess I was wrong about where "negative" came from, but still I would have thought that "current popular usage" was more relevant than popular usage before 1957. If the latter is the terminology you used in your youth, fine, I don't expect you to give it up. But you might want to keep in mind that for most people, the term "negative double" does not mean "any takeout double" and never did. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RSClyde Posted January 11, 2013 Report Share Posted January 11, 2013 I don't understand the question: I'm not on lead. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lord Molyb Posted January 11, 2013 Report Share Posted January 11, 2013 You can't lead against your own contract. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
aguahombre Posted January 11, 2013 Report Share Posted January 11, 2013 You can't lead against your own contract.It was his way of saying he won't bid, and can't do anything else in "response" because partner is on lead. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bigbenvic Posted January 11, 2013 Report Share Posted January 11, 2013 I am going to take a punt and guess that you are 24 years old. Oh to be 24 again :-( Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PhilKing Posted January 11, 2013 Report Share Posted January 11, 2013 And even though there's probably 15 holes in my logic, I don't think I'm foolish for bidding 5♥. Now, if they were vulnerable... I might be a little less convinced. The silver bullet is that partner will often raise to six and go off when we bid Five Hearts. The big money is in bidding and making slam - not trying to land on a pinhead at the five level. By stipulating that a removal to five of a suit shows a better and more shapely hand, we make our slam decisions more accurate. Also, your example hands are all pretty suitable. Partner is allowed to have a good 4351, for instance, in which case bidding rates to work very poorly. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lord Molyb Posted January 11, 2013 Report Share Posted January 11, 2013 It was his way of saying he won't bid, and can't do anything else in "response" because partner is on lead.Well, obviously :P Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lord Molyb Posted January 11, 2013 Report Share Posted January 11, 2013 The silver bullet is that partner will often raise to six and go off when we bid Five Hearts. The big money is in bidding and making slam - not trying to land on a pinhead at the five level. By stipulating that a removal to five of a suit shows a better and more shapely hand, we make our slam decisions more accurate. Also, your example hands are all pretty suitable. Partner is allowed to have a good 4351, for instance, in which case bidding rates to work very poorly.Yeah, I pretty much live in hypothetical land; it's driven my partner nuts before. :DBut even on this sort of pin that we are trying to land on, I will still try to land in it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ArtK78 Posted January 11, 2013 Report Share Posted January 11, 2013 If the latter is the terminology you used in your youth....Why do I get the feeling that I was just insulted? :) Pardon me, my rocking chair just got stuck. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vampyr Posted January 11, 2013 Report Share Posted January 11, 2013 Why do I get the feeling that I was just insulted? :) Pardon me, my rocking chair just got stuck. No, I do not consider being old a condition for which insults are appropriate. I am getting pretty old myself. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
paulg Posted January 11, 2013 Author Report Share Posted January 11, 2013 I am getting pretty old myself.Feeling very old is when you help out with the junior (U26) trials and the person who finishes in second place was born in 2000. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vampyr Posted January 11, 2013 Report Share Posted January 11, 2013 Feeling very old is when you help out with the junior (U26) trials and the person who finishes in second place was born in 2000. Feeling very old is when the radio plays "oldies" and you were a teenager or older when they first came out. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gordontd Posted January 11, 2013 Report Share Posted January 11, 2013 The silver bullet is that partner will often raise to six and go off when we bid Five Hearts. The big money is in bidding and making slam - not trying to land on a pinhead at the five level. By stipulating that a removal to five of a suit shows a better and more shapely hand, we make our slam decisions more accurate. Also, your example hands are all pretty suitable. Partner is allowed to have a good 4351, for instance, in which case bidding rates to work very poorly.One might happily ignore all the noise in the rest of the thread, and leave only this. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Phil Posted January 11, 2013 Report Share Posted January 11, 2013 Oh to be 24 again :-( LOL - can I go back to 24 again, even if it means I get dinged for 800 once in a while? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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