Showing hearts rather than minors

[straube]

So we play a strong club relay system. Our 1H response is any semi positive and our 1S is any double negative.

 

 

Our other one club responses are...

 

1D-gf, balanced or any unbalanced hand with a major

1N-GF, both majors

2C-GF, both minors

2D-clubs

2H-3 suited short a major

Etc-patterning out diamond hands

 

 

Thinking

 

1D-GF, bal or any unbalanced hand with spades/minor or unbalanced hands with minors

1N-GF, both majors

2C-hearts and clubs

2D-hearts

Etc-hearts and diamonds

 

Is this an improvement? is it very marginal or worth doing?

[Zelandakh]

I think it would be better if your 2♣ response showed hearts and diamonds. So either

 

1♦ = bal or any hand without hearts

1N = hearts or hearts and clubs

2♣ = hearts and diamonds

2♦+ = both majors

 

or

 

1♦ = bal or any hand without hearts

1N = both majors

2♣ = hearts and diamonds

2♦ = hearts

2♥+ = hearts and clubs

 

I slightly prefer the first of these and I prefer both to your current scheme, not surprisingly since it is getting closer to mine :). This also seems to lead onto another option where the 1♦ response shows hearts or a DN, say:-

 

1♦ = DN or GF hearts and not 5 spades (over 1♥: 1♠ = DN; 1N = ♥+♣ (incl 3-suited with short spades); 2♣ = ♥+♦; 2♦ = ♥; 2♥ = bal with 4-5♥, not 4♠; 2♠ = ♥+♠, bal or 3-suited; 2NT+ = 5+♥4♠)

1♥ = SP

1♠ = GF, no major

1N = GF, spades and clubs (incl 3-suited with short hearts)

2♣ = GF, spades and diamonds

2♦ = GF, spades

2♥ = GF, bal with 4-5 spades, not 4 hearts

2♠ = GF, 5+ hearts, 5+ spades

2NT+ = GF, 4 hearts, 5+ spades

 

I am not sure about this, especially the hands with both majors, and I suspect the structure can be improved. It does seem like the 2-way 1♦ bid would be ok in competition when it shows a definite suit if positive.

[straube]

Thanks for your help.

 

As far as the 1D response, the idea behind it is to allow opener to reverse relay and it really only accomplishes this is if is game forcing. If we weren't using it so, I'd prefer 1D as 0-7 or maybe 5-7.

 

I think you like the idea then of showing hearts and differentiating majors at the expense of the minors. Is that right? One thing arguing for keeping hearts or spades in the 1D response is that they are less easily preempted if the opponents bid a minor while hands with minors are easily preempted if the opponents have a major. Of course, I worry about hearts when the opponents have spades.

[Zelandakh]

Yeah, I like being able to show families of hands together, especially when that means differentiating majors quickly. That is why my choice of responses always shows a major immediately if one is held. The last idea is essentially a corruption of that; indeed it is one that I might look into further since it has certain advantages over what I am using. Also, am I right in thinking that you reverse relay only when Opener is balanced? If that is the case then you are still fine after the 2-way 1♦. 1♣ - 1♦; 1NT = 17-19 bal. Now 2♣ starts reverse relays (but Relayer is known to have 4+ hearts!) and the DN hand can either pass or take out into a suit. Admittedly the 20+ balanced hands have to relay though.

 

Having the heart hands in 1♦ is not really a problem providing there are only heart and DN hands. At worst we can double. But yes, the preempt effect is one reason for suggesting 1♠ as GF without a major. I actually think the worst hands in those auctions are the balanced ones and try to get the major on those into the auction asap, similarly to the 2♥ response in the last scheme. Unbalanced GF hands can almost always find a way to get themselves across.

[straube]

No, whenever one of us has a balanced hand and the other has an unbalanced hand, we manage to have the balanced hand be captain. We make single steps with balanced hands to give each other a chance to spin off unbalanced hands. Like so...

 

1C-1D (bal or with a major)

.....1H- (bal or spades)

..........1S (bal or H/C)

...............1N-bal

....................2C-bal w/major

....................2D-bal w/o major

....................etc-H/C

[straube]

1C-

.....1D-bal, C, D, S, S/C, S/D, C/D, C/D/M

..........1H-relays

...............1S-bal, C/D

...............1N-S, S/C

...............2C-S/D

...............2D-C

...............2H-C/D/M

...............etc-D

.....1N-H/C, H

.....2C-H/D

.....2D-H

.....etc-H/C

 

I think Zelandakh would like this better. Still looking for opinions whether it's better to differentiate the heart hands right away.