Slam try?

[hrothgar]

 

And hrothgar, it has been decades since I played blue club, and I maynot be well versed in their current (or even past 20 years or so) cue-bidding style. But my recollection from the very first English Blue Team book (the blue one) and T. Reese's book, was that they bid first or second round controls up the line, including distributional controls (at least in late 60's early 70's). You said you bid first round controls first I believe in one post supporting steve (I problably should go back and look to make sure) and don't cue-bid distributional controls in your parnters suit. Is this really the modern Blue Team cue-bidding style?

 

Before I switched to MOSCITO I played a fairly "traditional" Blue Club variant.  The only real deviation was that we used a multi 2D and Muiderberg 2H/2S openings.

 

As you note, the cue bidding style was to show 1st/2nd round controls up the line.  Players cue bid both honors and shortage, however, during the first pass you should not cue bid a shortage in partner's bid suit.  

[inquiry]

Not cue-bidding shortage in partner's suit on first pass, even if you use the style of first or second round control up the line makes sense to me. But this discussion started way back on why 6H wasn't reached... and it was, IMHO because the responder failed to bid 4C, bidding 4D instead. What you said about that then was.

In my own cue bidding style, the 4D bid would be strong, but ambiguous regarding a club control since responder can't cue bid a club shortage.

So I assumed you wouldn't cue-bid shortage in your partners suit more or less ever (not just first pass).  And I was pretty sure my ancient memory reminds me that Blue Team do cue-bid shortness., whichi prompted my reply...

 

You even stated in an earlier post that "many authorities" recommend not cue-bidding shortness in your partners suit. Ok, first round of cue-bidding, I agree with that, but second round, no. And in an EVEN earlier post, you suggested that 4D shows Diamond control (first) but does not deny second round control in Clubs. So what I was trying to probe, given your statement that your cue-bidding style is based upon blue-team, is would blue team people cue-bid 4Cs? I am fairly sure that in in the early 70's they would have.

[hrothgar]

Not cue-bidding shortage in partner's suit on first pass, even if you use the style of first or second round control up the line makes sense to me. But this discussion started way back on why 6H wasn't reached... and it was, IMHO because the responder failed to bid 4C, bidding 4D instead. What you said about that then was.

So I assumed you wouldn't cue-bid shortage in your partners suit more or less ever (not just first pass).  And I was pretty sure my ancient memory reminds me that Blue Team do cue-bid shortness., whichi prompted my reply...

 

You even stated in an earlier post that "many authorities" recommend not cue-bidding shortness in your partners suit. Ok, first round of cue-bidding, I agree with that, but second round, no. And in an EVEN earlier post, you suggested that 4D shows Diamond control (first) but does not deny second round control in Clubs. So what I was trying to probe, given your statement that your cue-bidding style is based upon blue-team, is would blue team people cue-bid 4Cs? I am fairly sure that in in the early 70's they would have.

 

 

I think I see where the confusion comes from.

When I originally answered the question, I was assuming a "standard" North American cue bidding style in which players only show first round controls.  Accordingly, the 4D cue is ambiguous about a 2nd round distirbutional club control.

 

I also commented that in my own cue bidding style, we cue bid both 1st/2nd round controls, but here too there is an ambguity.  In this case this is arising because we would not show distributional shortage in the suit that partner opened on the first pass.

 

Accordingly, using either cue bidding style I lwould jump to 5H over 4D.

[inquiry]

 

 

I think I see where the confusion comes from.

When I originally answered the question, I was assuming a "standard" North American cue bidding style in which players only show first round controls.  Accordingly, the 4D cue is ambiguous about a 2nd round distirbutional club control.

 

I also commented that in my own cue bidding style, we cue bid both 1st/2nd round controls, but here too there is an ambguity.  In this case this is arising because we would not show distributional shortage in the suit that partner opened on the first pass.

 

Accordingly, using either cue bidding style I lwould jump to 5H over 4D.

 

Ok... I know I feel like we have beaten this dead horse too much already. With your jump to 5H (asking for good trumps), you get to 6H opposite both....

S-xx H-AKQxx D-AKQx C-x    (making), and

S-x  H-AKQxx D-AKQx  C-xx  (not a real chance)

 

On to some other, exciting topics... take a look at the favorite pscyhic thread in expert/advanced thread and see if you have any comments there ---- I am much less opinionated about psychics...  ::)

[hrothgar]

 

Ok... I know I feel like we have beaten this dead horse too much already. With your jump to 5H (asking for good trumps), you get to 6H opposite both....

S-xx H-AKQxx D-AKQx C-x    (making), and

S-x  H-AKQxx D-AKQx  C-xx  (not a real chance)

 

 

And I am happy to do so.

 

First and foremost, recall that I have 5 clubs.  This suggests that responder has 2 spades and 1 club.

 

Even if responder shows up with the 1552 hand, I can easily make 6H if the opps don't find the club lead + continuation off the top.  (AKQ of spades will give me the club pitches that I need)

 

After a fairly quick + uniformative auction the opps are going to be make a blind opening lead.  If the club honors are split, the opps will probably favor a spade lead.  If the club honors are together AND the opener leaded has AK of clubs we're in bad shape.  If the club honors are together and the opening leader has xxxx in both black suits we're 50-50%.

 

Double dummy this doesn't rate to be a good slam.

Luckily, the opponents rarely defend double dummy.