Cold Grand

[TWO4BRIDGE]

Bocchi ( North )

 

[hv=pc=n&s=sa987hakqdat98ckq&n=stht6dkq652caj654&d=w&v=n&b=12&a=ppp2np3sp4dp4hp5hp5sp7dppp]266|200[/hv]

 

Shown is their bidding . [ Maybe you can explain it for me. Where did North show the ♣A ? Edit: and the ♦ KQ for that matter ? ] .

 

So, how would us mere mortals bid it ? [ The other table stopped in 6D ... making +1 ] .

[TimG]

In the match I was watching, they made easy work of it after North opened 1♦. Looks like an opening bid to me.

[awm]

Elianna and I would bid:

 

Pass - 2♣(1)

2♦(2) - 2NT(3)

3♠(4) - 4♦(5)

4♠(6) - 4NT(7)

5♠(8) - 7♦(9)

 

(1) Strong artificial

(2) Game force; a 3m response (natural GF) is a bad idea with this pattern

(3) 22+

(4) Both minors

(5) Four card diamonds

(6) Cuebid

(7) 1430 keycard

(8) Two with the queen

(9) Can count tricks, ruffing a club if necessary

 

Sam and I would have some long relay auction with a lot of alerts to the same contract.

 

I don't think this is a particularly tough one, even though I wouldn't open the north hand playing standard methods (opening hands like this too often leads to a 3NT contract on light values, where the 5/5 shape is not worth nearly as much as it would be in a suit; holding both majors would be a different story of course).

[lalldonn]

How did the other table miss it? This seems like a very easy grand to bid whether north opens or not. Personally it would never occur to me to not open the north hand.

[Flem72]

Bocchi ( North )

 

[hv=pc=n&s=sa987hakqdat98ckq&n=stht6dkq652caj654&d=w&v=n&b=12&a=ppp2np3sp4dp4hp5hp5sp7dppp]266|200[/hv]

 

Shown is their bidding . [ Maybe you can explain it for me. Where did North show the ♣A ? ] .

 

So, how would us mere mortals bid it ? [ The other table stopped in 6D ... making +1 ] .

 

In these (2N-3S/3N(forced)-4M = stiff, 5-5 m SI) and also 1SNT-3M (= stiff, (45) minors), I like to play that when O chooses a m, R has a game signoff but treats the 4m as a RKCB call, responding around the signoff.

[akhare]

Reaching 7♦ would a cinch for straube and me, playing strong ♣ with relays.

 

South opens 1♣ (16+):

 

1♣ - 2♣ (GF, minors)

2♦ (ask) - 2♠ (at least 5-5 in the minors)

...

[TheoKole]

As north I could use 2NT opener as both minors weak 6 to 10 or strong 18 plus

 

The bidding would probably go

2NT - 3 ♥ (cue bid forcing to game)

3 ♣ - 3 ♦ (showing fit and establishing trumps)

3 ♠ (cue bid probably short suit) - 4NT (ace asking 1430)

5 ♠ (2 key cards with Q) - 7 ♦ (can count 13 tricks)

 

Good luck and keep counting,

 

Theo

[TWO4BRIDGE]

How did the other table miss it? This seems like a very easy grand to bid whether north opens or not. Personally it would never occur to me to not open the north hand.

I don't remember the bidding exactly, but they only made cuebids and no RKC. [ As Justin has said, it is hard to bid a grand w/o RKC ] .

[TimG]

One vugraph table missed the grand with the following auction 2N-6♦.

[JLOGIC]

One vugraph table missed the grand with the following auction 2N-6♦.

 

great auction

[SteveMoe]

Something perhaps like this in precision:

[hv=d=w&v=n&b=12&a=ppp1cp2dp2np3cp3dp4sp4np5sp7d]133|100[/hv]

 

or this in 2/1:

[hv=d=w&v=n&b=12&a=ppp2cp2dp2np3sp3np4sp5hp5np7dppp]133|100[/hv]

[paulg]

The two Scotland pairs both bid the small slam (with the third pair having a bye). This resulted in a gain of 12 imps for the Women (!) and a loss for the Seniors. I don't know their auctions but I suspect that they started 1♦-2NT showing a game-forcing balanced(-ish) hand and the wrong hand ended up in control.

[dake50]

Slam try after ask minors must have 3+ controls of CA,DK,SK.

[bluecalm]

W/e there is to show 22-23 balanced then 3S as minors and it's easy ride from there as S see there are no major suit losers and A♣ completes the hand. I consider it to be very easy grand to bid.

 

For example:

 

2C - 2D

2N - 3S

4D - 4S (cuebid)

4N - 5S (2key cards + QD)

7D

 

13 tricks because partner has at least one 5 card minor.

[Cyberyeti]

N has an opening hand, all S needs to know is that N has (any 4 cards), KQxxx, Axxx to bid the grand, this is not difficult.

 

1♦-2♦(inverted)-3♣-4♥(KC)-5♦(2+Q)-7♦ would do

[bluecalm]

Opening the bidding with N hand is marginal at best. I think most elite players would pass it.

[sfi]

6 losers, a couple of defensive tricks, and an easy rebid. What's lacking to make this not an opening bid?

[sfi]

Reaching 7♦ would a cinch for straube and me, playing strong ♣ with relays.

 

If you can't comfortably reach this grand playing strong club with relays in an uncontested auction, you really need to not be playing that system.

[Cyberyeti]

Bill Jacobs Fantunes:

 

2♦(5+♦ 10-13)-2♥(relay)

3♣(natural 4+♣, 0-1♠)- now all responder needs to know is how many keycards so 7 is easy.

 

And a rule of 20 hand with all the points in the long suits and an obvious rebid is a very comfortable opening bid unless you're playing 2/1, where it's a little more awkward but not much.

[bluecalm]

6 losers, a couple of defensive tricks, and an easy rebid. What's lacking to make this not an opening bid?

 

Losers doesn't matter.

What is lacking is strength. This hand will not be enough opposite many hands partner forces to game with.

I am not saying you can't open I am saying it's not clear at all to open and many players playing standardish systems routinely pass this hand.

[Zelandakh]

1♦ = 10-17, 4+ diamonds, unbal

... - 1♥ = INV+ relay

1♠ = min, not 4 spades unless also 4 hearts

... - 1NT = GF relay

2♣ = 4+ clubs

... - 2♦ = relay

2♠ = 5+ diamonds, 5+ clubs

... - 2NT = relay

3♣ = 0-1 spades

... - 3♦ = relay

3NT = 1255, 3 controls

 

Then either continue relays or

... - 4♦ = puppet to 4♥

4♥

... - 4♠ = RKCB for diamonds

5♥ = 2 or 5 key cards with ♦Q

... - 7♦

 

I like the RKCB option best here I think. If I think about it for half an hour or so I can probably find a way to ask about the ♣J too, but the TD tends to get a bit upset with you when you try that at the table! I am surrpised noone has given an auction to 7NT yet; even more surprised that so many expert pairs languished in 6♦. The 2NT - 6♦ auction...was 2NT strong balanced or both minors?

[TWO4BRIDGE]

 

I am surprised no one has given an auction to 7NT ....

As one poster put it, South thought he might need a ♣-ruff ( ... doesn't know about the Jack ) .

[kenrexford]

I probably could have one of the more rapid auctions conceivable:

 

2♣-2♠(positive with one or both minors)

2NT(yes?)-3♠(stiff spade)

7♦

 

But, I'd probably be safe as Opener and use RKCB for diamonds.

 

 

EDIT: Why am I doing that?!?!? 7NT seems obvious now.

[TWO4BRIDGE]

W/e there is to show 22-23 balanced then 3S as minors and it's easy ride from there as S see there are no major suit losers and A♣ completes the hand. I consider it to be very easy grand to bid.

 

For example:

 

2C - 2D

2N - 3S

4D - 4S (cuebid)

4N - 5S (2key cards + QD)

7D

 

13 tricks because partner has at least one 5 card minor.

If 3S! shows BOTH minors, I'm sure you have sequences where Responder has only ONE long minor, slammish.

The 2006 ACBL bulletin solved that problem in this way:

After

2NT - 3S! = relay to 3NT

 

3NT - ?? then:

........ Pass = to play ( Needed since direct 3N is major 44 )

........ 4C = slam try in clubs

........ 4D = slam try in diam

........ 4H = h splinter, both minors

........ 4S = s splinter, both minors

........ 4N = invitational to 6N ( both minors , no shortness?? 4/4, 4/5 or 5/4 )

........ 5N = forcing to 6N, invitational to 7N

 

Thus,

p - 2C

2D! ( waiting, but positive )

..... - 2NT ( 22-24 )

3S!

..... - 3NT ( forced )

4S! ( minors, ♠-shortness )

..... - 4NT ( 6 Ace RKC )

5S ( 2 + 1Q )

..... - 7D

[bluecalm]

I don't like it. I don't want relays to 3NT, I want a bid to show minors so partner can bid 3NT if he doesn't like minors.

Why not use 4C/4D as natural slam tries ?

 

Pass = to play ( Needed since direct 3N is major 44 )

 

This is bad. They double 3S often enough to hurt you. Added precision will never be worth it and you can't play 3NT opposite hand with minors which sucks.

 

 

4S! ( minors, ♠-shortness )

..... - 4NT ( 6 Ace RKC )

 

While 3S as transfer to 3N is bad this is very very bad, you can't even play 4NT now.

So if opener is 4-4-3-2 you are in 5-3 or 4-3 5m instead of NT game.

 

This is what happens when some crazy tinkerer start writing systems forgetting about how bridge scoring works.