ATB?

[lalldonn]

[hv=pc=n&s=st9ha4dkq9873caj7&n=saj65hk63da42cq32&d=s&v=n&b=15&a=1d(10-15%2C%202+D)d1sp2n(relay)p3c(forced)p3d(14-15%2C%206+D%2C%200-2%20S)p4dp4hp4sp5cp6dppp]266|200[/hv]

4H, 4S, and 5C were cuebids. Anyone could have bid 4NT 1430 at any time if they wanted to. Other bids are alerted.

[Cyberyeti]

Over optimistic N. Presuming the cues are 1st or second he deserves south to have xx, Ax, KQJxxx, KJx and the contract to have no play. Even 3 keycards and Q♦ is not enough (make J♣ the J♦ and slam is almost no play at all), so N has decided that S has some extra shape and that either he has a seventh diamond or one of the cues was a singleton or both.

 

As far as S is concerned he has a pretty good hand for his bid with two aces and the trump KQ.

[wank]

north needs a perfecto to make slam. jumping to 6♦ at the end was v bad.

 

4♦>>>5♦ would be perfectly adequate from north.

[gnasher]

I agree that North overdid it, but I'd expect to make 6♦ a lot of the time. If LHO has something like KQxx QJxx x Kxxx he can't avoid a black-suit squeeze. I don't think North can reasonably play for that in the bidding, because South might have a hand like x Axx KQxxxx AJx where there's no 11th trick.

[jdeegan]

:P It's not the worst contract in the world. You need either a club lead and split spade honors, or split spade honors and the club hook. If the opps give you enough time, there might even be a squeeze. Still, you shouldn't bid it. North was at fault pushing with 4-3-3-3 and 14 HCP opposite 15 or 16 HCP and a fit with a six-bagger but no big spade fit. W/o a ruffing trick in the north hand, your side just does not have enuf stuff for slam. Just settle at 3NT.

 

Consider that w/o the spade 109, which didn't figure in the auction, your play for 6♦ is minimal.

[rogerclee]

because South might have a hand like x Axx KQxxxx AJx where there's no 11th trick.

 

I think you are taking the description of 2N..3D a little bit literally, this hand is not close to being good enough for 2NT. Even the actual hand was pretty debatable.

 

Also FWIW if LHO has all the black suit honors, 4 spades, and diamonds are not 4-0 this hand is cold for 6D, but you must be a little bit careful in the play (it is more complicated than at first glance) (edit: never mind, no you don't). Maybe the bidding wasn't great, but there is nothing at all wrong with the contract. However, I think you are down if LHO is 3415.

[han]

What is 2NT..3D and why is it not explained literally? We cannot judge the auction if we are not told what the bids mean.

[lalldonn]

:P It's not the worst contract in the world. You need either a club lead and split spade honors, or split spade honors and the club hook.

There are tons more chances than that on the actual cards. In fact I almost regretted posing the bidding problem, because on analysis this turned out to be one of the most interesting play problems I have seen in a very long time. We spent probably 30 minutes analyzing after the fact and still aren't sure we covered everything. However, I will offer that on the auction and given the exact cards held (which you may argue were lucky to be held, such as the spade spots) I think slam is very good on best play.

 

What is 2NT..3D and why is it not explained literally? We cannot judge the auction if we are not told what the bids mean.

I tried to be literal, it's true. This auction shows any hand that you think would be worth 1D then 3D in the context of playing precision, and that lacks three spades. IMO gnasher's hand doesn't qualify only because of the diamonds being KQxxxx, whereas if they were KQT9xx it would be clear to make this bid. Hopefully that clarifies, unless clee disagrees in which case it clarifies nothing.

[TWO4BRIDGE]

I need to know what the hcp range is for South's 2NT-jump with his 14 hcp hand .

EDIT: OK, I just clicked on the 3D "explanation" ... 14-15 hcp, etc.

...... North to blame with his flat 14 hcp.

 

Why on earth would Responder cooperate for slam with his own 14 hcp, flat hand if he knows partner's hand isn't even worth a 3D-jump ?

[y66]

I think North needs more to bid 6D.

[Finch]

I also think North overdid it. It's hard to see how South could have a better hand (other than a 7th diamond)

[lalldonn]

Does anyone feel like analyzing the play? It's very interesting, remembering that west made a takeout double of 1D. West leads the 9 of hearts, and when you draw trumps west shows up with a singleton and pitches hearts on the next two.

[rhm]

Does anyone feel like analyzing the play? It's very interesting, remembering that west made a takeout double of 1D. West leads the 9 of hearts, and when you draw trumps west shows up with a singleton and pitches hearts on the next two.

What took you 30 minutes to analyze this?

West is marked with all the black honors for his double. The hand is cold if West has 4 cards in ♠, which is very likely, given that West has both spade honors and West shows out on the second diamond.

Win the heart in hand and just run diamonds and watch West discards. Discard from dummy 2 clubs, including the queen (not necessary, but out of principle), and a heart.

In the six card ending West will have to come down to 4 spades and the doubleton king of clubs. (If West discards a spade you have 3 easy tricks in spades)

Now play the ♠T from hand.

If the ♠T gets covered, win and play a spade to the ♠9. If West wins he will have to return a spade and the ♥K will now execute a black suit squeeze. If West lets the ♠9 hold, go to dummy with the ♥K and endplay West with the fourth spade.

If the ♠T does not get covered play the ♠9, which presumably gets covered. Simply duck and West is endplayed. If the ♠9 does not get covered either, you have a black suit squeeze for 13 tricks.

If I have not a bad day I would expect to get that right at the table.

 

Rainer Herrmann

[dave_w]

Does anyone feel like analyzing the play? It's very interesting, remembering that west made a takeout double of 1D. West leads the 9 of hearts, and when you draw trumps west shows up with a singleton and pitches hearts on the next two.

 

I win the ♥A to retain a dummy entry and cash the ♦A (standard safety play even without the takeout double).

And then lead a Diamond to hand. And play the ♠9. If LHO is 3415 I think I need to sneak the ♠9 past him in order to make. And if he covers I need a re-entry to hand which can only be in trumps.

 

So he splits, I win and play trumps coming down to ♠Jxx ♥K ♣x opposite ♠T ♥x ♣AJx.

 

If LHO was 4414 then

LHO must have 3 spades (otherwise I can lead the spade ten and establish the long spade - if he ducks I can cross in Hearts and end play him) and thus has Kx of Clubs left. So I play the ♠Ten, he wins and returns a Spade and I cash the Heart to Squeeze him or he ducks and I cross in Hearts which strip-squeezes him.

 

If LHO was 3415 then:

LHO must have 2 spades left (otherwise the spade lead will endplay him) and RHO must have 3 spades left. I play a spade LHO wins and plays a spade and I cash the Heart and I go one down.

 

I just can't make if they are 3415 - unless RHO gets the defence wrong (no Major suit squeeze since he sits over dummy). Oh no Club pitch on the Diamonds. They would have found that for sure from 5 (what can it cost) so they must be 4414 (ugh don't tell me 5413 is possible - I might not get the count in time)

 

If LHO was 5413 then:

They must have 3 spades left (having pitched one) and I'll play to establish spades by leading the ♠Ten and they duck and I cross in Hearts to end play them and they pitch a spade and I throw them in. But if they are 5413 and can see it coming then they can keep 4 spades in the ending (having already bared the ♣K) and I'll play this way and exit a spade to endplay them and RHO will show out and LHO will laugh at me. Good defence - I can't see any way to get the count.

 

Hmmmmz, if you spent half an hour then I guess I've missed something (trumps 4-0 isn't a problem on my line since I crossed in Spades once anyway).

[lalldonn]

Are you all sure both spades are onside?

[Phil]

Are you all sure both spades are onside?

 

With a stiff diamond? Yes, I think its highly odds-on the spade pics are. What's up with the lead (getting LOL'd with QJT9 here? 2/4?)? What did RHO play on the heart?

[rhm]

Are you all sure both spades are onside?

If RHO has a spade honor the hand can not be made against good defense unless RHO has precisely ♠Q87 or ♠K87.

But the lines winning against these unlikely layouts are not compatible with LHO holding ♠KQxx or longer, which is much more likely

If you play the ♠T (or 9) early, when you still have communication in ♦, LHO covers.

If you run all diamonds, the second ♠ is ducked, when RHO has a spade honor.

If you play the second ♠ before all diamonds, a heart is returned when LHO has both spade honors.

 

If you play a spade after 3 rounds of diamonds, RHO can win and return a club if the ♥K is still in dummy. If not he can cash high hearts.

 

 

Rainer Herrmann

[dave_w]

Are you all sure both spades are onside?

 

I'm not sure. In fact now that you mention it I'm almost certain the Spade honours are split. Does one even need to know the auction or the rest of one's hand if looking at KQxx in Spades to know what to lead against a 6 level contract. Okay, checking the auction is allowed in case the 6 level contract is Spades. But on this auction a Spade lead must stand out if opening leader has the KQ.

 

I don't think I can do it against best defence. LHO has to cover the first Spade and RHO has to switch to Clubs and all my entries are gone for a squeeze. Unless the squeeze can operate before I lose the Spade trick but I don't think that's true (I can't see any way to cash the ♥K given I need it for an entry to dummy and besides RHO can beat me by keeping a Spade honour and a long Heart then.

 

Still I guess that adds value to running the ♠9 early. Less likely to be covered and less likely to know what's going on at that point.

[rhm]

I'm not sure. In fact now that you mention it I'm almost certain the Spade honours are split. Does one even need to know the auction or the rest of one's hand if looking at KQxx in Spades to know what to lead against a 6 level contract. Okay, checking the auction is allowed in case the 6 level contract is Spades. But on this auction a Spade lead must stand out if opening leader has the KQ.

 

I don't think I can do it against best defence. LHO has to cover the first Spade and RHO has to switch to Clubs and all my entries are gone for a squeeze. Unless the squeeze can operate before I lose the Spade trick but I don't think that's true (I can't see any way to cash the ♥K given I need it for an entry to dummy and besides RHO can beat me by keeping a Spade honour and a long Heart then.

 

Still I guess that adds value to running the ♠9 early. Less likely to be covered and less likely to know what's going on at that point.

 

Running the ♠9 at trick 2 from hand might be the best compromise.

If LHO ducks you are home, if LHO has 4 or more cards in spades, even if RHO has a spade honor.

If LHO covers, win and play him for KQxx and run diamonds.

 

Rainer Herrmann