wank Posted February 21, 2012 Report Share Posted February 21, 2012 is how my X (at matchpoints) was described by a world class player.... agree? i was more than a bit surprised by the response. obv a 2nd spade would be nice, but it seems a little pathetic to me to pass here at MPs. My 2nd choice was 2♥, not pass which he advocated. A little linguistic context might be helpful for non-English people: mad people need to be certified as such to permit their being remanded to psychiatric hospitals. [hv=pc=n&s=sqhqt876dj43cat74&d=s&v=e&b=3&a=p1d1s2dd]133|200[/hv] Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ggwhiz Posted February 21, 2012 Report Share Posted February 21, 2012 I prefer 2♥ as pard may be stuck and bid 2♠ with modest heart support but I'm often dyslexic enough to have a heart in with my clubs. Only my partner thinks that is certifiable and I kinda think pass is for people that sleep with a night light or are never seen without an umbrella. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
menggq Posted February 21, 2012 Report Share Posted February 21, 2012 2♥ definitely. If QX QT9X JX ATXXX.I prefer DBL 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rogerclee Posted February 21, 2012 Report Share Posted February 21, 2012 Double is better than 2H, but I agree with the commentator that pass is quite normal. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gszes Posted February 21, 2012 Report Share Posted February 21, 2012 a cruddy hand to be sure but ceritiable come on:) your p chose a 1s overcall that usually occurs whenthey either have really decent spades or a hand thatlooks like a poor candidate for a tox (especiallyin this case where the bidding makes it look likep is short in dia) the x is much more flexible (p might even bid 2h with3 of them and a non rebiddable spade suit). The xalso keeps clubs alive which 2h will usually bury. This is my way of saying WD I agree with the x andthey might as well send the butterfly nets after meas well. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kayin801 Posted February 21, 2012 Report Share Posted February 21, 2012 Pass is certifiable. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
the hog Posted February 21, 2012 Report Share Posted February 21, 2012 I think this is an obvious double. I cannot understand pass and I suspect your "world class" player is world class only in his own underpants.Further x is a far better call than 2H - the H suit is not that good and the X gives you extra flexibility. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MrAce Posted February 21, 2012 Report Share Posted February 21, 2012 is how my X (at matchpoints) was described by a world class player.... agree? i was more than a bit surprised by the response. obv a 2nd spade would be nice, but it seems a little pathetic to me to pass here at MPs. My 2nd choice was 2♥, not pass which he advocated. A little linguistic context might be helpful for non-English people: mad people need to be certified as such to permit their being remanded to psychiatric hospitals. [hv=pc=n&s=sqhqt876dj43cat74&d=s&v=e&b=3&a=p1d1s2dd]133|200[/hv] Pass would not even occur to me both in mp and imps tbh. I would much rather DBL now than getting into tank after/if pd doubles 2♦ or bid something else. I obviously would feel awful as well if it went all pass, had i not doubled. Having said that, if responsive double requires tolerance to pd's suit by agreement , to me Queen singleton qualifies for it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
y66 Posted February 21, 2012 Report Share Posted February 21, 2012 Pass does seem a little pathetic at MP. Like X. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gnasher Posted February 21, 2012 Report Share Posted February 21, 2012 Double looks OK to me. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wank Posted February 21, 2012 Author Report Share Posted February 21, 2012 to anyone doubting the accuracy of 'world class', the player in question has World Open and European Open medals. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gnasher Posted February 21, 2012 Report Share Posted February 21, 2012 to anyone doubting the accuracy of 'world class', the player in question has World Open and European Open medals.The opinions of a world-class player are still only opinions, albeit well-informed ones. When it's a matter of style, like this one, there's unlikely to be a consensus even amongst the very best players. Anyway, I can guess who it was and you know that he always exaggerates his views. If he says "certifiable", that's like someone else saying "I don't agree with it." Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wank Posted February 21, 2012 Author Report Share Posted February 21, 2012 i suspect you guessed wrong though of the 2 possibilities. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Codo Posted February 21, 2012 Report Share Posted February 21, 2012 To possess medals from the BB/World Open etc means a lot, but it does not say that you have the ultimate bidding style for anybody. Double looks obvious to me. If partner has a quite weak hand with spades, he will have good spades and my hand will be nothing to be ashamed of in 2 Spade. So what can be the reason for your expert to disagree?Mabe this: After one spade your chances of game are too low to go for it- and if you have game, partner will surely bid again, even if yoou pass now. And if you have no game, your best result could be to defend 2 diamond- which will be literally impossible after your double. Just a guess. As I said, I had doubled without losing too many thoughts about this. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
whereagles Posted February 21, 2012 Report Share Posted February 21, 2012 Normal dbl to me as well. 3H is a possibility too. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Phil Posted February 21, 2012 Report Share Posted February 21, 2012 I like double. It brings clubs into the picture, and partner can give heart preference on three. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Poky Posted February 22, 2012 Report Share Posted February 22, 2012 Bridge is all about finding and implementing profitable bidding strategies. Bidding with Hxx in opponent's suit and shortness in partner's suit is one of most unprofitable solutions ever (you have a classic situation like: xx-Hxx-Hxx-Hxxxx after 1♠-2♦...). Keep doubling with hands with decent equity (partial length in partner's suit, partial shortness in opponents' suit), passing with bad hands (especially when they have much passive values) and you results will on the long run be much better. Pretty easy stuff even for a non-world-class player, I would say. However, even 2♥ is better than double (since 2♥ only places the contract while the double virtually promises a 2nd spade). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gnasher Posted February 22, 2012 Report Share Posted February 22, 2012 If double really "virtually promised" two spades, obviously it would be foolish to double. I just don't think it does - I think it shows hearts and clubs, which is what I have. I expect partner to bid a four-card round suit if he has one, and if he rebids 2♠ with a six-card suit that's fine too. If he is 5323 he will usually bid 2♥. The only problem is if he has a 5233 shape, with opponents being in a non-fit. Luckily, most opponents won't be in one of those, but if they are we'll also end up in a non-fit. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jmcw Posted February 22, 2012 Report Share Posted February 22, 2012 At the table I would have X'd, but reading the comments and thinking it through gives me doubts. Easy to see how a X could work out badly, but, on balance I still think it right to bid. I would prefer a better suit to bid 2♥ and it runs the risk of losing the ♣ suit. With shortness in ♦ partner may well show ♥ with only 3 so X seems the most flexible call. X = 102♥ = 7P = 6 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Poky Posted February 22, 2012 Report Share Posted February 22, 2012 If double really "virtually promised" two spades, obviously it would be foolish to double. I just don't think it does - I think it shows hearts and clubs, which is what I have.With singleton spade, you have a decent defense against 2♦ too. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gnasher Posted February 22, 2012 Report Share Posted February 22, 2012 With singleton spade, you have a decent defense against 2♦ too.Maybe. Or maybe I have enough defence to beat 3♦ but not enough to beat 2♦. Give partner some ordinary hand like AKxxx Kxx xx xxx. How much chance will we have against 2♦ after partner leads a top spade? If we compete to 2♥, we have a good chance of making that, but it's more likely that they'll compete to 3♦ and go one down. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
benlessard Posted February 22, 2012 Report Share Posted February 22, 2012 We are a passed hand W vs red so i wont have 6H here. My style is to bid 2H with 4/5H & doubleton S and X show H+clubs and very often a stiff S. The downside of this is that with a 2425/2434 you need to choose between 2H or X. (since partner will play you with a stiff S and might pass the takeout X). With a decent 2326 Its tougher for me to X and correct 2H to 2S, so im stuck to bid 2S. The upside is that you can play 2Dx and 3Dx more often. Here however the hand is a bit light and i would pass. playing more standard methods I strongly believe that partner need 3 or Hx to pass 2H (by a passed hand) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Poky Posted February 22, 2012 Report Share Posted February 22, 2012 Maybe. Or maybe I have enough defence to beat 3♦ but not enough to beat 2♦. Give partner some ordinary hand like AKxxx Kxx xx xxx. How much chance will we have against 2♦ after partner leads a top spade? If we compete to 2♥, we have a good chance of making that, but it's more likely that they'll compete to 3♦ and go one down.If you double with a wide range (read: any crap), partner will lose security in competition when it gets to the 3rd level. Your hand isn't quite an "ordinary hand". Besides, with this hand you can protect 2♦ with a double (if you hate let them play a contract so much). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gnasher Posted February 22, 2012 Report Share Posted February 22, 2012 Your hand isn't quite an "ordinary hand". Besides, with this hand you can protect 2♦ with a double (if you hate let them play a contract so much).Are you really saying that with AKxxx Kxx xx xxx the overcaller should bid1♦ 1♠ 2♦ passpass dbl? And I don't hate to let them play a contract, I just like plus scores more than I like minus scores. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JLOGIC Posted February 22, 2012 Report Share Posted February 22, 2012 I would always double Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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