billw55 Posted February 10, 2012 Report Share Posted February 10, 2012 [hv=pc=n&e=s82h84dqj82cak932&d=n&v=0&b=1&a=pp1dp1np2np3nppp]133|200[/hv] IMP pairs, non vul. What is your lead choice? I am interested in the expert approach here. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rogerclee Posted February 10, 2012 Report Share Posted February 10, 2012 I would lead a low club, our best chance of beating this is surely taking 4 clubs and some other trick. RHO usually has 4 clubs on this auction (unless 3343 or 3352), but if partner has an entry we can take 4 clubs as long as he has Tx or Jx (if declarer ducks then we are likely to be able to get 3 clubs and 2 other tricks). I usually like to lead an honor here but on this hand it's right to play low. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
whereagles Posted February 10, 2012 Report Share Posted February 10, 2012 Club I guess. Pard didn't overcall. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
phil_20686 Posted February 10, 2012 Report Share Posted February 10, 2012 Club I guess. Pard didn't overcall. I am majorly torn between a top club and a low club. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mikeh Posted February 10, 2012 Report Share Posted February 10, 2012 Low club, for the reasons given by roger. I can't see how a high club is a better choice....layouts where it is necessary are not easy to create, and it is trivial to show layouts where it is disastrous. I do disagree with roger in his choice of 3352 as a possible holding for declarer....altho admittedly this is imp pairs. Only an idiot or someone with no respect for his partner bids 1N on that shape. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
quiddity Posted February 10, 2012 Report Share Posted February 10, 2012 I do disagree with roger in his choice of 3352 as a possible holding for declarer....altho admittedly this is imp pairs. Only an idiot or someone with no respect for his partner bids 1N on that shape. Did you misread the opening bid (1♦)? If not I don't understand the above comment. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HighLow21 Posted February 10, 2012 Report Share Posted February 10, 2012 Small diamond. Very close to leading a small club. Any major suit has almost no chance of defeating the contract and leading A or K from AKxxx is not good practice in most cases. Partner had a chance to overcall with a decent major and didn't do so. An opening major lead is likely to expose that suit's lie at trick 1 and, in all likelihood, finesse partner. 1NT bidder is practically guaranteed to have 4 clubs. If they are good clubs, like QJTx or even QJ8x, leading them doesn't get us very far. If I had the 10 of clubs instead of the 3, I would lead a club. Diamonds may actually be the best suit for our side. 1D opener may have 4-4-3-2 shape (in which case diamonds are definitely the suit to lead), but in any other case he will have 4+ diamonds. When leading dummy's 4-card suit, you should lead 4th best unless you hold a 4-card sequence. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
whereagles Posted February 11, 2012 Report Share Posted February 11, 2012 I am majorly torn between a top club and a low club. Well, low seems better. You may not have an entry. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mikeh Posted February 11, 2012 Report Share Posted February 11, 2012 Did you misread the opening bid (1♦)? If not I don't understand the above comment.Do you understand the difference between dummy and declarer? Or opener and responder? Assume partner opens 1♦ and you hold 3=3=5=2 shape. Would you be tempted to raise? Or to grab dummy with 1N? I was expressing my view of the latter. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
daveharty Posted February 11, 2012 Report Share Posted February 11, 2012 Assume partner opens 1♦ and you hold 3=3=5=2 shape. Would you be tempted to raise? Or to grab dummy with 1N? I was expressing my view of the latter.I know many people who are systemically constrained to respond 1NT with this shape, if the hand falls between their partnership definitions of 2D and 3D. The alternative seems to be bidding a three card major which is unpalatable to many people. Maybe not ideal, but quite common in "inverted minor" territory. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gordontd Posted February 11, 2012 Report Share Posted February 11, 2012 I know many people who are systemically constrained to respond 1NT with this shape, if the hand falls between their partnership definitions of 2D and 3D.Why would they have a gap between 2D & 3D? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BunnyGo Posted February 11, 2012 Report Share Posted February 11, 2012 Why would they have a gap between 2D & 3D? A lot of B/I americans play 3D is weak and 2D is GF, they have a gap for the constructive-limit hands. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mikeh Posted February 11, 2012 Report Share Posted February 11, 2012 A lot of B/I americans play 3D is weak and 2D is GF, they have a gap for the constructive-limit hands.this is posted in the A/E forum...I doubt that we should cater to this sort of issue.... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wyman Posted February 11, 2012 Report Share Posted February 11, 2012 A lot of B/I americans play 3D is weak and 2D is GF, they have a gap for the constructive-limit hands. A lot of A/E play 3D is weak and 2D is limit+ (or they play criss-cross, or whatever). This leaves constructive hands to bid 1N, which I think is a somewhat normal treatment. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
quiddity Posted February 11, 2012 Report Share Posted February 11, 2012 Do you understand the difference between dummy and declarer? Or opener and responder? Assume partner opens 1♦ and you hold 3=3=5=2 shape. Would you be tempted to raise? Or to grab dummy with 1N? I was expressing my view of the latter. I thought you might have seen the auction as starting with 1♣ in which case I would tend to respond 1♦ with 3=3=5=2.With the auction as shown I would bid 1NT with something like KJx Qxx Txxxx QT; 2♦ would be a limit raise and 3♦ would be mixed. I guess this could qualify as a mixed raise but for me it looks more like a 1NT response. edit: The other thing that confused me about the first comment was "admittedly it is imp pairs.." With imp scoring I miss the constructive raise more; if this were matchpoints I would probably respond 1NT with that hand even if a constructive raise were available. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
daveharty Posted February 11, 2012 Report Share Posted February 11, 2012 As wyman says, it's not just B/Is who play this way. I didn't want to get off-track with an inverted minor discussion; I just wanted to point out that there are reasons aside from wanting to hog the dummy that someone might bid 1NT. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BunnyGo Posted February 11, 2012 Report Share Posted February 11, 2012 this is posted in the A/E forum...I doubt that we should cater to this sort of issue.... Agreed, I was simply answering the question. As for the OP, I too thought a low club lead is much better. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JLOGIC Posted February 11, 2012 Report Share Posted February 11, 2012 "Standard" in america is to have no constructive raise and to play 1D-3D as weak and 1D-2D as limit+ and to bid 1N with the constructive raise hand type as far as I understand. Whatever, I'd lead a low club regardless, clee nailed it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vampyr Posted February 11, 2012 Report Share Posted February 11, 2012 "Standard" in america is to have no constructive raise and to play 1D-3D as weak and 1D-2D as limit+ and to bid 1N with the constructive raise hand type as far as I understand. Whatever, I'd lead a low club regardless, clee nailed it.This is very strange. There has got to be a better way... I use 2NT as the weakest raise, which allows for all raises. I am sure you have something sensible too. This is kind of a side issue I guess, but it would be nice to know the opponents' approach here. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
billw55 Posted February 11, 2012 Author Report Share Posted February 11, 2012 OK, low club seems to be the winner. I thought this would be the case but wanted to be sure. A low club was in fact the table lead, next I will post the follow up as a defense problem. As an aside, would anyone have chosen to open the bidding in second seat with east's hand? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
whereagles Posted February 12, 2012 Report Share Posted February 12, 2012 If I were playing a 9-11 NT or weak 2C opener, sure. Otherwise, no thx :) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HighLow21 Posted February 13, 2012 Report Share Posted February 13, 2012 OK, low club seems to be the winner. I thought this would be the case but wanted to be sure. A low club was in fact the table lead, next I will post the follow up as a defense problem. As an aside, would anyone have chosen to open the bidding in second seat with east's hand? Not me. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
phil_20686 Posted February 13, 2012 Report Share Posted February 13, 2012 I can't see how a high club is a better choice....layouts where it is necessary are not easy to create, and it is trivial to show layouts where it is disastrous. Its not better in the sense of picking up more club layouts, but only that with north bidding 1N over 1D he is quite likely to be long in clubs and short in diamonds. A chance to keep on lead an switch to diamonds might be valuable. ESP if they play a style where they open 1d with 4432 and (43)33, which is hardly unknown. A low club lead commits you to trying to set up clubs rather than diamonds before they set up any major suit tricks. Given partner failed to overcall 1D with 1M, either he is very weak or they have plenty of major suit cards. The number of layouts where a top club and a club continuation hurts is is pretty small if you exclude 3-3 club breaks, and I for one think its unlikely the clubs are 5332 around the table. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ArtK78 Posted February 13, 2012 Report Share Posted February 13, 2012 I would open 1NT (10-12) on these cards at this vulnerability, as that is the system that I play. Playing any normal system, however, this is a pass. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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