Positive Strong Club responses: controls or shape

[Free]

Shape can be shown different ways. Precision uses longest suit first.

 

What about those schemes that show 4+ long majors before longer minors in some or all cases? Moscito shows 4+ long suits in ascending order, regardless of which is longest, and uses relays to sort the length issue out. MAFIA bids any 4+ major before a longer minor but, unlike Moscito, with both majors bids the longest first regardless of rank with 5+ in the longest major.

 

If you elect to show shape first and are not permitted to use relay systems (translation: subject to ACBL GCC), does it make sense to use either of those approaches that show a 4CM ahead of a 5-card minor?

 

A third alternative might be a canape style. Here is a quick stab at that:

 

Initial responses:

1M = 4+ long (if 4, unbalanced)

1NT = balanced

2m = 3+ minor (usually 4+ unless 5M332); may be canape major if strong

2M, 3m = 1-suited, 12+

2NT = 2-suited in minors, 8-11

 

 

After 1C-2C, 2D = relay and then:

2M = 5+ in bid major, 12+ HCP

2NT = Good 5-card clubs suit, 12+

3C = 1-suited, 8-11

3D = clubs + diamonds, 12+

3M,3NT = SPL, 1-suited in clubs, 12+

 

After 1C-2D, the scheme would be similar except that 2NT = diamond-heart canape with 12+.

 

This scheme of 2m responses is taken straight from Blue Club 2000.

Am I confused, but if you aren't allowed relay-systems, why are you allowed a 2♦ relay after 1♣-2♣? :)

[pbleighton]

"Am I confused, but if you aren't allowed relay-systems, why are you allowed a 2♦ relay after 1♣-2♣? "

 

You can use a relay system after 1 of a suit if it starts with the opener's rebid, but not if it starts with the responder's first bid.

 

Don't ask why.

 

Peter

[hrothgar]

Am I confused, but if you aren't allowed relay-systems, why are you allowed a 2♦ relay after 1♣-2♣? :D

Here is my best guess. As always, this is a somewhat jaded/cynnical view.

 

The ACBL wants to ban relay responses to 1♦, 1♥, and 1♠ openings.

 

The ACBL wants to allow players to use whatever response structures they like over strong Club openings and openings >= 1NT.

 

The actual regulations that the ACBL has created don't necessarily support this set of goals, however, that's why the ACBL like preserving so much discretionary authority.

 

Personally, I prefer clearly defined regulatory structures with little room for wriggling, but then again, I have a somewhat idiosyncratic view of the purpose of the "Laws".

 

I am a strong believer that purpose of the Laws is to protect the rights of players from the regulators.

 

There is an equally valid interpretation that the purpose of the Laws is to empower the regulators to take whatever actions that they feel fit.

 

This debate often centers on the Law 40D

 

40 D. Regulation of Conventions

 

The sponsoring organisation may regulate the use of bidding or play conventions. Zonal organisations may, in addition, regulate partnership understandings (even if not conventional) that permit the partnership's initial actions at the one level to be made with a hand of a king or more below average strength. Zonal organisations may delegate this responsibility.

 

Case in point: Many senior member of the Laws Committees claim that Law 40D is an enabling tool and that it permits broad descretionary authority to local regulators. Endicott and David Stephenson both state that Law 40D permits local regulators to create rules such as "Anyone with a last name beginning with F may not use any conventions during the auction."

 

Players who primarily view the Laws as a mechanism to protect themselves against the powers that be are somewhat dismayed by this assumption... For what its worth there are some interesting political analogies here.

[keylime]

We've implemented a pseudo-form of canape when a GF minor hand is responder.

 

1♣*-1♥* (spades, clubs, or 15+ balanced)

1♠*-2♣* (my hand is clubs pard)

 

2♦* asks about the club hand whereas:

 

2♥ = one or both majors (to inquire, bid 2♠)

2♠ = non minimum with shortage (2Nt asks with one under shortages)

2NT = balanced, non minimum

3♣ = generic minimum, where 3♦* asks for stoppers towards 3NT

3♦ = 6 or more clubs with exactly 4 diamonds

 

 

And likewise,

 

1♣*-1♠* (hearts, diamonds or 12-14 balanced)

2♣* (asks):

 

2♦ = hearts (after accept of xfer, second bid shows four cards)

2♥/♠ = four in bid suit with five or more diamonds

2NT = 12-14 balanced

3♣ = 4 clubs with five or more diamonds