Gerben47 Posted October 10, 2004 Report Share Posted October 10, 2004 [hv=d=e&v=n&s=s852hajt2daj74ca2]133|100|Scoring: MP[/hv] RHO opens 1♦, pick your poison!1NT would be 15 - 18 balanced + stopper. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Free Posted October 10, 2004 Report Share Posted October 10, 2004 easy 1♥ imo, pass is an alternative in this vulnerability... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
luke warm Posted October 10, 2004 Report Share Posted October 10, 2004 i passed... i'd like to see where this goes... change the ♥J to the Q or K and i'd overcall Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
helium Posted October 10, 2004 Report Share Posted October 10, 2004 PASS kenneth Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
inquiry Posted October 10, 2004 Report Share Posted October 10, 2004 1♥ (new shorter answers) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
luke warm Posted October 10, 2004 Report Share Posted October 10, 2004 1♥ (new shorter answers) hehe just remember, i asked for no short answers... so if the occasion arises ...... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
whereagles Posted October 10, 2004 Report Share Posted October 10, 2004 1H for me too. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fluffy Posted October 10, 2004 Report Share Posted October 10, 2004 Pass, althou 1♥ is close. I prefer to be unbalanced (normally having 5 cards on the opponet´s suit) when overcalling 4 card majors. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pclayton Posted October 10, 2004 Report Share Posted October 10, 2004 1♥. I'm surprised so far at the # of votes for pass. If you pass, you can't be happy if it continues 1♠ - pass - 2♠, or even 1N - pass - pass. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Flame Posted October 10, 2004 Report Share Posted October 10, 2004 1♥. I'm surprised so far at the # of votes for pass. If you pass, you can't be happy if it continues 1♠ - pass - 2♠, or even 1N - pass - pass. Pass is the normal bid. this is the bid i would teach my student to bid, but i believe 1H is better one, and maybe in advance course i would teach that, but im definetly not surprise by the voting, even more then that im pretty sure that had good and known players like Ben and Free didnt give their opining of 1H, the results were even stronger from passing. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
whereagles Posted October 10, 2004 Report Share Posted October 10, 2004 If it goes (1D) pass (1S) pass(2S) pass pass ..?? pard will have spade and diam shortage, so he might double. Trouble is he may not wish to go to the three-level, particularly since he probably won't have many points (you have a good hand). Therefore an immediate 1H bid might be better. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pclayton Posted October 10, 2004 Report Share Posted October 10, 2004 If it goes (1D) pass (1S) pass(2S) pass pass ..?? pard will have spade and diam shortage, so he might double. Trouble is he may not wish to go to the three-level, particularly since he probably won't have many points (you have a good hand). Therefore an immediate 1H bid might be better. You are putting a lot of pressure on pard to balance with his doubleton spade and (roughly) 6 count. It can't be right to pass this prime 14 count at the one level and put pard under the gun like that at the 3 level, especially at MP's. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
whereagles Posted October 10, 2004 Report Share Posted October 10, 2004 Precisely. That's why I prefer to bid 1H :) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
luke warm Posted October 10, 2004 Report Share Posted October 10, 2004 ok, so it goes(1d) 1h (1s or x) 2h now do you think opener is going to support spades? yes if his pard bid 1s, and even maybe yes if he doubled instead... say he does bid 2s here... now what? pard, according to what i've read, has a 6 count... should he bid 3h, thinking i have 5? should he double? pass? we're going on the assumption that responder bids spades, and that opener supports spades... if this is true, it will most likely be true whether or not i overcall 1h... the only advantage i see to 1h is as a possible lead directing bid... however, i'm not certain it's the best lead... against 2s, a trump might be best... just a thought Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Free Posted October 10, 2004 Report Share Posted October 10, 2004 It's MP's, and I want to keep them out of an easy 3NT if they have that... Lead directing overcall helps a lot. I'm also ready to play in a moysian (I like them a lot), so why not overcall your best suit and see where it gets opps? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pclayton Posted October 11, 2004 Report Share Posted October 11, 2004 ok, so it goes(1d) 1h (1s or x) 2h now do you think opener is going to support spades? yes if his pard bid 1s, and even maybe yes if he doubled instead... say he does bid 2s here... now what? pard, according to what i've read, has a 6 count... should he bid 3h, thinking i have 5? should he double? pass? we're going on the assumption that responder bids spades, and that opener supports spades... if this is true, it will most likely be true whether or not i overcall 1h... the only advantage i see to 1h is as a possible lead directing bid... however, i'm not certain it's the best lead... against 2s, a trump might be best... just a thought Well, fine. Over 2♠, in my finely-tuned partnership :) (using Rubens / Robson stuff); I will know if partner has: 1. A weak 3 card raise. (I'll pass and hope to beat it with a heart out, or at least get a better score than those that didn't overcall) 2. A strong 3 card raise (I'll double to tell pard its our hand. He'll pull with a stiff spade usually). 3. A really strong 3 card raise (I'm sawing off 2♠ and expecting to get rich) 4. Clubs (not sure what I'll do over 2♠) All hands with 4 card support make THEM decide at the 3 level; either 3♥ (weakish - I'll play 3♥ or expect to beat 3♠) or 2N (mixed - I'm doubling 3♠) or 3♦ (limit - probably bidding game I guess, not sure). How can we be worse off if we didn't overcall 1♥? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
the hog Posted October 11, 2004 Report Share Posted October 11, 2004 ok, so it goes(1d) 1h (1s or x) 2h now do you think opener is going to support spades? yes if his pard bid 1s, and even maybe yes if he doubled instead... say he does bid 2s here... now what? pard, according to what i've read, has a 6 count... should he bid 3h, thinking i have 5? should he double? pass? we're going on the assumption that responder bids spades, and that opener supports spades... if this is true, it will most likely be true whether or not i overcall 1h... the only advantage i see to 1h is as a possible lead directing bid... however, i'm not certain it's the best lead... against 2s, a trump might be best... just a thought Jimmy, your partner should never bid 3H in these auctions if he raises to 2H first. He should always bid to the limit that he is prepared to bid to on the first round. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
junyi_zhu Posted October 11, 2004 Report Share Posted October 11, 2004 [hv=d=e&v=n&s=s852hajt2daj74ca2]133|100|Scoring: MP[/hv] RHO opens 1♦, pick your poison!1NT would be 15 - 18 balanced + stopper. easy 1H and the only choice in my humble opinion. If you always pass with this kind of hands, your partner needs to balance very aggressively and even if he balances aggressively, you still may not catch up and you may often suffer a huge penalty if you balance too aggressively. Basically, in my idea, one should never pass an offensive oriented opening hand when he has a simple overcall at one level. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
daswallow Posted October 11, 2004 Report Share Posted October 11, 2004 Close decision. Definitely not 1NT, so 1♥ or pass. I think I will go for 1♥ due to lead directing value. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EricK Posted October 11, 2004 Report Share Posted October 11, 2004 Dealer: East Vul: N/S Scoring: MP ♠ 852 ♥ AJT2 ♦ AJ74 ♣ A2 RHO opens 1♦, pick your poison!1NT would be 15 - 18 balanced + stopper. easy 1H and the only choice in my humble opinion. If you always pass with this kind of hands, your partner needs to balance very aggressively and even if he balances aggressively, you still may not catch up and you may often suffer a huge penalty if you balance too aggressively. Basically, in my idea, one should never pass an offensive oriented opening hand when he has a simple overcall at one level. Is this an offensively oriented hand? It looks like a 8-loser balanced hand with some strength in RHO's suit. If partner is always going to raise to 2♥ on xxx, and to 3♥ on xxxx, then I am not sure I want to bid this one immediately. Eric Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
luke warm Posted October 11, 2004 Report Share Posted October 11, 2004 Over 2♠, in my finely-tuned partnership :blink: (using Rubens / Robson stuff); I will know if partner has: 1. A weak 3 card raise. (I'll pass and hope to beat it with a heart out, or at least get a better score than those that didn't overcall) 2. A strong 3 card raise (I'll double to tell pard its our hand. He'll pull with a stiff spade usually). 3. A really strong 3 card raise (I'm sawing off 2♠ and expecting to get rich) 4. Clubs (not sure what I'll do over 2♠) All hands with 4 card support make THEM decide at the 3 level; either 3♥ (weakish - I'll play 3♥ or expect to beat 3♠) or 2N (mixed - I'm doubling 3♠) or 3♦ (limit - probably bidding game I guess, not sure). How can we be worse off if we didn't overcall 1♥? i obviously don't know whether or not pass is better than 1h here, i'm just saying what i'd do... but on your list, i don't understand a few things... for example:#1 "A weak 3 card raise. (I'll pass and hope to beat it with a heart out, or at least get a better score than those that didn't overcall)" assuming ops were always gonna be in 2s, overcall or not, this seems to be based entirely on the lead of a heart, correct? maybe that will work, i don't know... that's why i said in my first post that i'd be more likely to overcall a 4 card suit with A, Q or K,Q or A,K than A,J; and "How can we be worse off if we didn't overcall 1♥?" i don't know... declarer may misguess the defense, maybe... i don't know what your p'ship uses to show your #'s 2 and 3 above, but it seems that the ops would know it's your hand also... course they may not care :) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
helene_t Posted October 11, 2004 Report Share Posted October 11, 2004 Pass. If p can't double (assuming LHO bids 1M or passes) I want to defend. If LHO bids 1NT I will regret it, but 1♥ is impractical with this bad suit. Non-vuln I might double. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chamaco Posted October 11, 2004 Report Share Posted October 11, 2004 Double.If pard bids 2C he is likely to have 5 cards and we'll play in the 5-2 fit. I am not happy with double but:1) passing is likely to bring a lost MP partscore battle. Partner will be under too much pressure, it s almost always better to try to give the values, at the cost of being somewhat offshape in the minor;2) I like to make a 4 card overcall if the suit has 2 of the top 3 honors, AJTx seems to mee too weak The closest other alternative to me is reevaluate the 14 hcp to 15 hcp (all prime values) and bid NT.Actually the K/R hand evaluator evaluates this hand 14.95.I prefer 1NT to both 1H and pas. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chamaco Posted October 11, 2004 Report Share Posted October 11, 2004 Is this an offensively oriented hand? It looks like a 8-loser balanced hand with some strength in RHO's suit. The hand is not 8 losers.Actually, with diamonds bid on the right, AJxx is not a 2 loser, closer to 1.5/1.75 loser suit:And in H, AJTx is closer to a 1.25 loser suit (double finesse, very likely to score either the J or the ten).On the whole, it is reasonable to assume that at least some finesse thru opener will work, bringing the hand to a 7 losers hand, which is considered by many non-Roth-Stone adepts a full opening hand :D . Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gerben47 Posted October 11, 2004 Author Report Share Posted October 11, 2004 Thanks for the responses. I think pass is defenitely out and so is 1NT, leaves 1♥ and dbl. This was played in a tournament and all four options were chosen at least once. The most interesting auction developed after dbl: 1♦ dbl 1♥ dbl2♣ pass 2♦ 2♠3♦ Dbl of 1♥ was penalty, but what do 2 alternative bids 2♦ and 2♥ mean here (instead of 2nd dbl). Both natural or just one of them? Anyway, what do you think the full hand is and what do you bid now? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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