rduran1216 Posted October 21, 2011 Report Share Posted October 21, 2011 QxxxxKQJxxxKx w/w matchpoints 1st chair Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Phil Posted October 21, 2011 Report Share Posted October 21, 2011 1♦. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hanoi5 Posted October 21, 2011 Report Share Posted October 21, 2011 1♦ most of the days. But I could pass. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lobowolf Posted October 21, 2011 Report Share Posted October 21, 2011 1♦...I don't see this as being particularly close. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sasioc Posted October 21, 2011 Report Share Posted October 21, 2011 1♦ and I don't think it's close either. If I was hypothetically not allowed to open 1D I'd open 3D rather than passing. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
aguahombre Posted October 21, 2011 Report Share Posted October 21, 2011 If in our partnership, 2d were available as a natural weak two, I would immediately find a different use for the bid....if for no other reason, so I wouldn't be tempted to bid 2D with this hand. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CSGibson Posted October 21, 2011 Report Share Posted October 21, 2011 1♦ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
the hog Posted October 22, 2011 Report Share Posted October 22, 2011 1D. I also find this not close. Lol at pass. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Onedown Posted October 22, 2011 Report Share Posted October 22, 2011 If in our partnership, 2d were available as a natural weak two, I would immediately find a different use for the bid....if for no other reason, so I wouldn't be tempted to bid 2D with this hand.Ridiculous post....I can understand those, well sort of who think this soft hand is worth 1 ♦BUT If you are playing weak 2s and your range is 6-11, then why not 2 ♦?? Did I miscount?..My calculator says 11, if I count on my fingees I have 11....what is the 11 for anyways if you won't bid 2 ♦with 11..is there 11 counts you will open 2 ♦ with? 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
aguahombre Posted October 22, 2011 Report Share Posted October 22, 2011 Ridiculous post....I can understand those, well sort of who think this soft hand is worth 1 ♦BUT If you are playing weak 2s and your range is 6-11, then why not 2 ♦?? Did I miscount?..My calculator says 11, if I count on my fingees I have 11....what is the 11 for anyways if you won't bid 2 ♦with 11..is there 11 counts you will open 2 ♦ with?Perhaps before you start calling people's posts ridiculous, you might consider that there might be those who like their preemptive openings to look differently than you do. It is a seven-loser hand with outside cards and suitable for play in another strain or in NT. Just because you have a bid available to show a point count which overlaps the point count of an opening one-bid, does not mean that you need to use it. There are other considerations, such as the many people above who also believe it is a comfortable 1D opening. If you would rather open it a weak two, go ahead. I would not call that choice ridiculous, merely suboptimal. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JLOGIC Posted October 22, 2011 Report Share Posted October 22, 2011 I would consider 2D r/w, but at w/w I would always just open 1. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BunnyGo Posted October 22, 2011 Report Share Posted October 22, 2011 1D > 3D > 2D >>>> pass Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EricK Posted October 22, 2011 Report Share Posted October 22, 2011 Playing a weak NT, I might venture 1NT. But otherwise 1♦ is clear. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gwnn Posted October 22, 2011 Report Share Posted October 22, 2011 Ridiculous post....I can understand those, well sort of who think this soft hand is worth 1 ♦BUT If you are playing weak 2s and your range is 6-11, then why not 2 ♦?? Did I miscount?..My calculator says 11, if I count on my fingees I have 11....what is the 11 for anyways if you won't bid 2 ♦with 11..is there 11 counts you will open 2 ♦ with?I've never heard of a 6-11 range, that seems too wide. 8-11 or 6-10 are fine but if I played 6-11 I'd always be reluctant to open with 11. But sure I would with something like Qx xx KJT9x KQx. Surely not KQJxxx and 5 more useful points. Anyway, I don't understand aguahombre's post so I'm not defending it, I just want to say that 6-11 is an uncommon and probably unsound range. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BunnyGo Posted October 22, 2011 Report Share Posted October 22, 2011 [Ridiculous post]....I can understand those, well sort of who think this soft hand is worth 1 ♦BUT If you are playing weak 2s and your range is 6-11, then why not 2 ♦?? Did I miscount?..My calculator says 11, if I count on my fingees I have 11....what is the 11 for anyways if you won't bid 2 ♦with 11..is there 11 counts you will open 2 ♦ with? [/Ridiculous post] FYP Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fluffy Posted October 22, 2011 Report Share Posted October 22, 2011 Agree with Sarah. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AlexJonson Posted October 22, 2011 Report Share Posted October 22, 2011 At MPs I would open 1D 25% of the time and 3D the rest. Maybe I'm in the wrong Forum. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rhm Posted October 22, 2011 Report Share Posted October 22, 2011 I would pass unless I have a weak two in ♦ available or a mini notrump and yes, I do not consider it close.I am not a Roth Stone fan and open other hands which many would pass. I am well aware that most Bridge players overvalue this type of hand constantly and refuse to learn from their results.The distribution is not good, neither is the honor structure. To prove my point I ran a simulation (1000 deals) giving partner exactly 12 HCP and balanced distribution. 3NT made on 207 deals and was down on 793 deals. Average number of tricks was 7.3Now single dummy you will make 3NT a little bit more often, but nowhere often enough. Rainer Herrmann 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AlexJonson Posted October 22, 2011 Report Share Posted October 22, 2011 I would pass unless I have a weak two in ♦ available or a mini notrump and yes, I do not consider it close.I am not a Roth Stone fan and open other hands which many would pass. I am well aware that most Bridge players overvalue this type of hand constantly and refuse to learn from their results.The distribution is not good, neither is the honor structure. To prove my point I ran a simulation (1000 deals) giving partner exactly 12 HCP and balanced distribution. 3NT made on 207 deals and was down on 793 deals. Average number of tricks was 7.3Now single dummy you will make 3NT a little bit more often, but nowhere often enough. Rainer Herrmann So how does 3D do in simulations? Too difficult a calculation, so it is just a judgement choice. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
han Posted October 22, 2011 Report Share Posted October 22, 2011 Of course I agree that this is not a good hand. But all white at matchpoints, it's not all about games. If partner forces to game, we may be too high, and we may not. But if partner does not force to game, I'm happy to have taken the first call. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sasioc Posted October 22, 2011 Report Share Posted October 22, 2011 I would pass unless I have a weak two in ♦ available or a mini notrump and yes, I do not consider it close.I am not a Roth Stone fan and open other hands which many would pass. I am well aware that most Bridge players overvalue this type of hand constantly and refuse to learn from their results.The distribution is not good, neither is the honor structure. To prove my point I ran a simulation (1000 deals) giving partner exactly 12 HCP and balanced distribution. 3NT made on 207 deals and was down on 793 deals. Average number of tricks was 7.3Now single dummy you will make 3NT a little bit more often, but nowhere often enough. Rainer Herrmann I can't speak for the other posters but in my regular partnership a balanced 12 count is not a game-force facing a 1 level opening, especially one made 1st in at white. I would not expect to play the deal you describe in 3NT and feel that 1D gains in a lot of partscore deals. I'm also not really sure what else I'm meant to open this - I'm far too good for a weak 2 under these conditions and not really suitable for 3D. I don't think that it makes theoretical sense to have hands that are considered too good for a weak 2 and not good enough for a 1 level opening so pass is certainly not an option for me. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sasioc Posted October 22, 2011 Report Share Posted October 22, 2011 Duplication, sry Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MrAce Posted October 22, 2011 Report Share Posted October 22, 2011 I would pass unless I have a weak two in ♦ available or a mini notrump and yes, I do not consider it close.I am not a Roth Stone fan and open other hands which many would pass. I am well aware that most Bridge players overvalue this type of hand constantly and refuse to learn from their results.The distribution is not good, neither is the honor structure. To prove my point I ran a simulation (1000 deals) giving partner exactly 12 HCP and balanced distribution. 3NT made on 207 deals and was down on 793 deals. Average number of tricks was 7.3Now single dummy you will make 3NT a little bit more often, but nowhere often enough. Rainer Herrmann Rainer balanced 12 hcp, if your pdship is opening light, is not a gf but invitation. You told us the simulation results vs a 12 hcp balanced hands but i am more interested in the results showing what would happen if we opened weak 2♦ with this and pd holding 13-14-15 hcp with xx ♦ because without a help in the suit most of the time it will be played there. Although the argument i am trying to make, i admit, makes more sense at IMPS. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rhm Posted October 22, 2011 Report Share Posted October 22, 2011 Of course I agree that this is not a good hand. But all white at matchpoints, it's not all about games. If partner forces to game, we may be too high, and we may not. But if partner does not force to game, I'm happy to have taken the first call.Unless I preempt opening hands is for me a question of strength. When our side has the opponents out-gunned I do not like to reach hopeless contracts on our own steam and baring a complete misfit I want my partners to be able to force to game if he faces an opening bid opposite mine. Passing does not mean you give up the part-score battle though I agree the side, which opens the bidding is better positioned when the bidding gets competitive. But a big part of this advantage stems from the fact that responder can rely on some strength when his partner has opened the bidding. Rainer Herrmann 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
aguahombre Posted October 22, 2011 Report Share Posted October 22, 2011 The modern paradox, ignored by many modern players, is that a hand which we would open is no longer game facing another hand we would open. Most responders, however, have adjusted the range upward a bit for invites to game or to slam. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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