frank0 Posted October 21, 2011 Report Share Posted October 21, 2011 If you use some 3 level response to 1NT(15-17) to show 5-5 major invitation and 5-5 major game forcing, then what is the meaning of the following sequence? 1NT-2♦-2♥-2♠ 1NT-2♥-2♠-3♥ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
guido Posted October 21, 2011 Report Share Posted October 21, 2011 If you use some 3 level response to 1NT(15-17) to show 5-5 major invitation and 5-5 major game forcing, then what is the meaning of the following sequence? 1NT-2♦-2♥-2♠ 1NT-2♥-2♠-3♥ It means what your partnership decides it means. With that very helpful advice <grin>, you might consider that there is no obvious way to signal slam aspirations in a single suited hand after the transfer. You can define the cheapest bid in the other major (i.e., the sequences you show) as a slam try in the shown major. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rbforster Posted October 22, 2011 Report Share Posted October 22, 2011 One treatment for the 2♠ rebid is an artificial minor suit slam try (these are hard to show unless you play 4 suit transfers, which I don't). Opener bids 2NT and then 3m is that suit with 1/3 honors, 3M is the corresponding minor but with 2/3 top, and 3N is either minor solid. You do have to remember that bidding 2♠ cancels the meaning of the heart transfer. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
the hog Posted October 22, 2011 Report Share Posted October 22, 2011 Why not 5-4 shapes? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MrAce Posted October 23, 2011 Report Share Posted October 23, 2011 One treatment for the 2♠ rebid is an artificial minor suit slam try (these are hard to show unless you play 4 suit transfers, which I don't). Opener bids 2NT and then 3m is that suit with 1/3 honors, 3M is the corresponding minor but with 2/3 top, and 3N is either minor solid. You do have to remember that bidding 2♠ cancels the meaning of the heart transfer. Of course this also disables you from making any superaccept bid. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Free Posted October 23, 2011 Report Share Posted October 23, 2011 Obviously this depends on the rest of your NT system, it's hard to say what you have and what you don't have. For example, do you have a way to show an invitational hand with 5♥-4♠? You could use 1NT-2♦-2♥-2♠ for that. Personally I have several ways to play 1NT-2♥-2♠-3♥:- INV with 5-5M- retranser, either INV 6♠ or slam going (part of a complete system of transfer extensions)- slam going setting ♠I've also seen people play this as GF 5-5M. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rbforster Posted October 23, 2011 Report Share Posted October 23, 2011 Of course this also disables you from making any superaccept bid.No, you just have to bid 2♠ for any super accept and responder will bid 2NT with real hearts (allowing opener to describe his super accept), or else responder bids 3m+ as before. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
aguahombre Posted October 23, 2011 Report Share Posted October 23, 2011 No, you just have to bid 2♠ for any super accept and responder will bid 2NT with real hearts (allowing opener to describe his super accept), or else responder bids 3m+ as before.Yes, that is the Walsh Relay agreement. The people who use 2D-2H-2S differently have 4-suit xfers available, just use stayman first for the minor suit slammish hands, or have other toys. This is not really a debatable thing. Totally dependent upon what everything else means, and everything is workable if thoroughly hashed out. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
barmar Posted October 23, 2011 Report Share Posted October 23, 2011 Why not 5-4 shapes?Because Smolen is available for that. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Free Posted October 24, 2011 Report Share Posted October 24, 2011 Because Smolen is available for that.I think Hog was a bit lazy and meant "invitational 5-4 shapes" Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
barmar Posted October 26, 2011 Report Share Posted October 26, 2011 I think Hog was a bit lazy and meant "invitational 5-4 shapes"I use Smolen for that, too. 1NT-2♣-2♦-2♥/♠ is invitational with Smolen shape. I give up creeping Stayman, but I don't consider it much of a loss. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zelandakh Posted October 26, 2011 Report Share Posted October 26, 2011 If the alternative hands discussed are already covered by system then we might conclude that the basic premise of the OP is wrong. Perhaps it should be re-stated as "since all major suit hands are already covered what is the best use of the (some) 3 level response?" Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Finch Posted October 29, 2011 Report Share Posted October 29, 2011 As everyone else has said, it depends on the rest of your system. What hand types are already covered, and which aren't? I play the first sequences as a 4-5 game force, and the second as a slam try in spades, but you wouldn't want to copy that unless you also took over the rest of our system (which I'm fairly certain you wouldn't want to do!) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kenrexford Posted October 29, 2011 Report Share Posted October 29, 2011 FWIW, I like: Creeping/garbage Stayman if 2♥ rebid Stayman...2♠ = 5 spades, unbalanced invite (might have four hearts if Opener bid 2♦) Transfer...2♠ is 5♥/4♠ invite But, I also am thinking of... Transfer...2♠ = Canape invite (longer spades than hearts) Transfer...3♥ = Canape invite (longer hearts than spades) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cyberyeti Posted October 30, 2011 Report Share Posted October 30, 2011 If you use some 3 level response to 1NT(15-17) to show 5-5 major invitation and 5-5 major game forcing, then what is the meaning of the following sequence? 1NT-2♦-2♥-2♠ 1NT-2♥-2♠-3♥Also depends what you play 1N-4any as, we play 1N-4♦ as 5-5 M to play or definite slam interest, with 1N-2♥-2♠-3♥-3N-4non♠ as the milder slam invite. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rbforster Posted October 30, 2011 Report Share Posted October 30, 2011 I also am thinking of... Transfer...2♠ = Canape invite (longer spades than hearts) Transfer...3♥ = Canape invite (longer hearts than spades)Sounds perfect for those situations where NT opener is a worse declarer than responder :P Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rbforster Posted October 30, 2011 Report Share Posted October 30, 2011 Also depends what you play 1N-4any as, we play 1N-4♦ as 5-5 M to play or definite slam interestin my years of playing 1NT-3♠ as 5/5 majors GF, this comes up quite rarely. However, something like half the time it has come up, partner has opened a 22(54) shape 1NT and bids 3NT instead of 4M. I wouldn't want to force past 3N unless your partner is more disciplined than mine ( and we certainly don't open most 22(54)s 1NT either). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Join the conversation
You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.