Rick Perry vs. Barack Obama

[PassedOut]

i think what bachman said concerns mainly bill mahr and his calling those two, and others some pretty vile names that nobody (no liberal politico, also) really complained about... is there a double standard, in your opinion?

Lots of mean things get said about candidates running for high office -- and right-wing politicos take a back seat to none in that regard.

 

Is it your opinion that the same standards should apply to women in college who advocate their views as those that apply to politicians running for president or vice-president?

[Winstonm]

i think what bachman said concerns mainly bill mahr and his calling those two, and others some pretty vile names that nobody (no liberal politico, also) really complained about... is there a double standard, in your opinion?

 

I see no comparison between calling a private law student a slut and calling a national public figure a stupid slut, especially when the national public figure is a stupid slut to begin with. :P

[kenberg]

I won't be defending Bill Maher, I have seen him once or twice and that's plenty. And anyone who chooses to go to Congress to present her views makes herself something of a public figure, subject to criticism. Still....

 

Limbaugh has a large audience. There apparently are people who like him and agree with him. Actually, I have never heard him. But I have heard the views of people who tell me that they listen to him. It's not the sort of conservative viewpoint that I hope to see in power.

 

What I said was that Republicans have to choose. They can go after the votes of people like me or they can go after the votes of those who tune in to Rush. Trying to go after both is apt to lose them both. This goes beyond the specifics of the moment.

 

But to the specifics. I'm of a certain age. Walking across campus one day I was listening to a a young guy, maybe 19, talking to a girl. It went like this: "When I was younger I used to do a lot of stupid ....ing .... But now that I am older I don't do stupid ....ing .... anymore" etc. Was she impressed? No. A guy, especially some fat old fart like Limbaugh, cannot call a young woman a slut. A guy who does not understand that is an idiot.

[luke warm]

Is it your opinion that the same standards should apply to women in college who advocate their views as those that apply to politicians running for president or vice-president?

no, it's my opinion that the same standards should apply to our leaders when it comes to lecturing us on public discourse and apologizing for the words of entertainers, regardless of their political leanings

 

I see no comparison between calling a private law student a slut and calling a national public figure a stupid slut, especially when the national public figure is a stupid slut to begin with. :P

either the word is offensive or it isn't... i don't personally think it's quite so bad, certainly not as bad as when mahr called palin a cunt... i think he went over the line on that one, even for him

 

A guy, especially some fat old fart like Limbaugh, cannot call a young woman a slut. A guy who does not understand that is an idiot.

i agree that there are more intelligent ways to make a point than by name calling... i was speaking more of the double standard and inconsistency when it comes to who gets criticized and who gets a pass

[kenberg]

I was unaware of the Maher comment. As I say I don't watch him. I think I can now claim that my choice to not do so shows some good judgment. It's amazing what passes for clever these days.

[billw55]

What I said was that Republicans have to choose. They can go after the votes of people like me or they can go after the votes of those who tune in to Rush. Trying to go after both is apt to lose them both. This goes beyond the specifics of the moment.

I am sad to say it, but lately it seems that there are a lot more of the latter. I suppose it could be just that those ones make more noise. Or am I just hoping in vain?

 

Compared to 20-30 years ago, it seems that the nation as a whole has become much more politically partisan. The actual candidate barely seems to matter. I think either party could nominate Pee Wee Herman and get a third of the votes or more.

 

And then there is the electoral college, which I feel should be abolished in favor of a straight popular vote. But that's another story.

[PassedOut]

no, it's my opinion that the same standards should apply to our leaders when it comes to lecturing us on public discourse and apologizing for the words of entertainers, regardless of their political leanings

I guess everyone agrees with that. Should an entertainer hurl hours of public insults and filthy comments at a conservative college student for expressing her views, that entertainer should also be criticized. And would be, I'm sure.

 

Men and women in politics do subject themselves to lots of scurrilous commentary from jerks like Limbaugh and Maher. They understand that when they choose to enter the arena. Hillary Clinton, for example, has taken lots of abuse.

 

College students do not choose to be vilified for expressing an opinion.

[Winstonm]

The sad part is that the people who religiously listen to Limbaugh consider him an intellectual.

[PassedOut]

The sad part is that the people who religiously listen to Limbaugh consider him an intellectual.

In Upper Michigan, where I live, lots of people listen to him, and I've listened to his shows on occasion too. He has an emotional appeal to lots of folks who are disappointed in how their lives have turned out and want to blame someone else for their failures (those damnable liberals).

 

Folks who put themselves into the public eye can handle over-the-top comments: Sorry, Rush Limbaugh: A response from the writer he called ‘b-i-itchy’

 

Having my work called “b-i-itchy” and “an out-and-out lie” was not how I expected to spend International Women’s Day. Usually, I spend International Women’s Day completely ignoring the fact that it is International Women’s Day.

 

But first things first.

 

My piece yesterday stating that AshleyMadison.com and SeekingArrangement.com were the only new companies to be advertised on Rush Limbaugh’s show was wrong. They want to be on his show, but Limbaugh said today that he won’t let them.

 

Whenever their ads claw their way onto a local radio station carrying Rush, Rush says, he contacts the relevant authorities immediately and has them pried off. To say that these are the companies he keeps would be misleading. They might like to be. But Rush has prevented them.

 

Still, the whole point of the piece was that the people most eager to be associated with Rush Limbaugh’s show are — well, advertisers seeking jerks. This has not changed.

College students don't have a public platform from which to defend themselves.

[Winstonm]

I think it should be noted, too, that there is a distinction between Limbaugh and Maher, in that Maher is admittedly a satirist/comedian whereas Limbaugh passes himself off as a political commentator/entertainer.

 

If I tune in to watch an HBO special program from a known liberal satirist, it should not surprise me to hear someone like Sarah Palin described as an ignorant cunt. It is certainly an insulting phrase to use about someone.

 

Limbaugh, on the other hand, stated that the act of a private law student wanting access to birth control indicated that she was a slut, that she would not be in need of contraceptives if here morals were not so low.

 

If anyone cannot see that the Maher's insulting characterisation of a public personality is different than Limbaugh's personal attack on a private individual I feel sorry for him as a human being - he must be missing much that occurs around him. Fox News is not synonymous with reality.

[ArtK78]

I think it should be noted, too, that there is a distinction between Limbaugh and Maher, in that Maher is admittedly a satirist/comedian whereas Limbaugh passes himself off as a political commentator/entertainer.

 

If I tune in to watch an HBO special program from a known liberal satirist, it should not surprise me to hear someone like Sarah Palin described as an ignorant cunt. It is certainly an insulting phrase to use about someone.

 

Limbaugh, on the other hand, stated that the act of a private law student wanting access to birth control indicated that she was a slut, that she would not be in need of contraceptives if here morals were not so low.

 

If anyone cannot see that the Maher's insulting characterisation of a public personality is different than Limbaugh's personal attack on a private individual I feel sorry for him as a human being - he must be missing much that occurs around him. Fox News is not synonymous with reality.

Congratulations. At least someone here knows the difference between the venom passed off as truth spouted by a political pundit who is on the nation's airwaves every weekday and the satire of a political comic who has a weekly comedy/political satire show.

 

At least Bill Maher makes it a point to include panelists with conservative viewpoints on his weekly discussion panels and he does not treat them as if they were idiots.

 

You earned one of my rare reputation up votes.

[blackshoe]

Neither is any other news medium.

[PassedOut]

...Limbaugh passes himself off as a political commentator/entertainer.

But Limbaugh's "political commentator" act is just his shtick as an entertainer. He says lots of stuff to entertain a particular demographic, stuff that he knows is ridiculous but that his current audience believes. (He's got a long history as an entertainer: an earlier shtick included poking fun at the hypocrisies of both conservatives and liberals. His current shtick has been by far the most successful for him.)

[luke warm]

If I tune in to watch an HBO special program from a known liberal satirist, it should not surprise me to hear someone like Sarah Palin described as an ignorant cunt. It is certainly an insulting phrase to use about someone.

but the question is, should it surprise (and bother) the president of the us, especially given his recent comments concerning his two daughters? and why in the world wouldn't that same president who was so bothered by the word slut not feel the need to say something about this? i think we all know the reasons, the 1 million reasons

 

and fwiw, limbaugh is and considers himself to be first and foremost an entertainer, albeit one who happens to comment on politics (to excess, some might say)

[kenberg]

I think it should be noted, too, that there is a distinction between Limbaugh and Maher, in that Maher is admittedly a satirist/comedian whereas Limbaugh passes himself off as a political commentator/entertainer.

 

If I tune in to watch an HBO special program from a known liberal satirist, it should not surprise me to hear someone like Sarah Palin described as an ignorant cunt. It is certainly an insulting phrase to use about someone.

 

Limbaugh, on the other hand, stated that the act of a private law student wanting access to birth control indicated that she was a slut, that she would not be in need of contraceptives if here morals were not so low.

 

If anyone cannot see that the Maher's insulting characterisation of a public personality is different than Limbaugh's personal attack on a private individual I feel sorry for him as a human being - he must be missing much that occurs around him. Fox News is not synonymous with reality.

 

Then I guess I will be receiving your sympathy, although as far as I know your assessment of my limitation as a human being are not widely shared. I view the comments attributed to them as atrocious. The childhood retort "What you say is what you are" comes to mind. It's at the right level of discourse. I have not been listening to either and I don't expect that to change.

 

I have never been fond of the "yeah, but look what your guy did" defense. The little I saw of Maher, I found him repulsive, but now I guess I missed the really cool stuff. Ignorant what? My God but he is clever. Can I see it on YouTube?

I cannot imagine trying Limbaugh.

[Winstonm]

Then I guess I will be receiving your sympathy, although as far as I know your assessment of my limitation as a human being are not widely shared. I view the comments attributed to them as atrocious. The childhood retort "What you say is what you are" comes to mind. It's at the right level of discourse. I have not been listening to either and I don't expect that to change.

 

I have never been fond of the "yeah, but look what your guy did" defense. The little I saw of Maher, I found him repulsive, but now I guess I missed the really cool stuff. Ignorant what? My God but he is clever. Can I see it on YouTube?

I cannot imagine trying Limbaugh.

 

Ken,

 

I am not defending Maher. But I would hope that you would agree that using an obscene mocking tagline for someone, i.e., Sarah Palin is an ignorant cunt, is much different that making an accusation that Sarah Palin really is a slut or a whore, and her actions prove it.

 

But - to my understanding - that is what Limbaugh did. He did not call the young lady "an ignorant slut"; instead, he stated that the reason she wanted contraceptives was due to her personal choice of actions, and that showed she was a slut and a whore.

 

The difference being that Maher only insulted one person, Sarah Palin, while Limbaugh, by framing his statement as he did, pointed a finger at all women who support the cause of birth control as being sluts and whores.

[kenberg]

I think Ellen DeGeneres is truly witty. That's for example. Just so you don't think I have no sense of humor at all. Tina Fey was hilarious with her impression of Sarah Palin. But I stopped equating crude with funny when I was about 12. Crude is ok, I can be crude. But in the two cases under discussion, it's stupid crude.

 

There are differences in the two cases. Of course. There are always differences. Not difference enough to impress me. but I acknowledge that there are differences.

 

OTOH, I admit that the list of people I don't find funny is rather long: Besides Maher, there is/was George Carlin, Jon Stewart, Woody Allen, for starters. Never cared for Monty Python either. I have no idea why the Marx Brothers were successful, except perhaps in a (that's a as in one) fifteen minute short. I was a big Sid Caesar fan though, but that was long ago. I watched maybe half of The Producers with Zero Mostel.

 

Anyway, back to politics. I could use a good laugh about now. I heard, if he was quoted correctly, that Gingrich described himself as a Tortoise and the other guys as Bunny Rabbits. I think he needs a new writer if he wants to do stand-up.

[Winstonm]

I think Ellen DeGeneres is truly witty. That's for example. Just so you don't think I have no sense of humor at all. Tina Fey was hilarious with her impression of Sarah Palin. But I stopped equating crude with funny when I was about 12. Crude is ok, I can be crude. But in the two cases under discussion, it's stupid crude.

 

There are differences in the two cases. Of course. There are always differences. Not difference enough to impress me. but I acknowledge that there are differences.

 

OTOH, I admit that the list of people I don't find funny is rather long: Besides Maher, there is/was George Carlin, Jon Stewart, Woody Allen, for starters. Never cared for Monty Python either. I have no idea why the Marx Brothers were successful, except perhaps in a (that's a as in one) fifteen minute short. I was a big Sid Caesar fan though, but that was long ago. I watched maybe half of The Producers with Zero Mostel.

 

Anyway, back to politics. I could use a good laugh about now. I heard, if he was quoted correctly, that Gingrich described himself as a Tortoise and the other guys as Bunny Rabbits. I think he needs a new writer if he wants to do stand-up.

 

For the record, I don't think it is clever to be crude. Actually, it gets tiring to hear. I always appreciated the humor of Bill Cosby because he can make fun of the human condition without being crude or degrading.

[kenberg]

Bill Cosby is also on my list of people I don't think are funny. Although I really don't think people find me humorless, not at all really, there are quite a few comedians that bore me silly. Gene Wilder also.

[luke warm]

The difference being that Maher only insulted one person, Sarah Palin, while Limbaugh, by framing his statement as he did, pointed a finger at all women who support the cause of birth control as being sluts and whores.

to the point about him insulting only "one person"... really? you either haven't been listening or you're not being completely honest... i didn't actually hear limbaugh, but from what i read he wasn't attacking womanhood (except insomuch as a member of that group chooses to feel attacked)... as wrong as i think his words were, his words were directed at one young woman, not all women... it's funny that in all your denials about defending maher, your every post has such a defense

 

to ken - did you think stephen wright was funny? i thought he was hilarious

 

I used to work in a fire hydrant factory. You couldn't park anywhere near the place.

Whenever I think of the past, it brings back so many memories .

I went to a general store, but they wouldn't let me buy anything specific.

[kenberg]

I have never heard of steven wright, but the samples are my sort of humor.

[PassedOut]

I used to work in a fire hydrant factory. You couldn't park anywhere near the place.

Whenever I think of the past, it brings back so many memories.

I went to a general store, but they wouldn't let me buy anything specific.

:lol:

Made my day -- thanks!

[Winstonm]

i didn't actually hear limbaugh, but from what i read he wasn't attacking womanhood

 

 

For posterity, here is the Limbaugh quote:

 

“What does it say about the college co-ed Sandra Fluke, who goes before a congressional committee and essentially says that she must be paid to have sex? What does that make her?” Limbaugh said on his radio show on Wednesday. “It makes her a slut, right? It makes her a prostitute. She wants to be paid to have sex. She’s having so much sex she can’t afford the contraception. She wants you and me and the taxpayers to pay her to have sex. What does that make us? We’re the pimps.”

 

That seems to me an attack on any woman who supports the mandatory contraception coverage - even if it is directed only at one person.

 

Compared to Maher's quote:

 

Did you hear this – Sarah Palin finally heard what happened in Japan and she’s demanding that we invade ‘Tsunami,’” Maher said. “I mean she said, ‘These ‘Tsunamians’ will not get away with this.’ Oh speaking of dumb tw**s, did you...”

 

Crude, yes. Are both uncalled for? Yes. Are they equivalent? No.

[Winstonm]

I have never heard of steven wright, but the samples are my sort of humor.

 

My favorite line of his is: "I'm a caesarian baby. You can't tell it, though, except every time I leave the house I go out the window."

[ArtK78]

My favorite line of his is: "I'm a caesarian baby. You can't tell it, though, except every time I leave the house I go out the window."

There are so many great lines by Steven Wright. One that I like is that he came upon a 24 hour convenience store and saw the owner leaving and locking up. "I thought you were open 24 hours?" he said. To which the owner replied, "Not in a row!"