Solutions for abuse

[Darjeeling]

I am surprised to see there is so little discussion on this forum about abuse in the form of rude behaviour.

Roughly once every hour I play someone crosses the line in my presence. There must be hundreds if not thousands of violations every day. The typical abuser goes around playing at random tables, waits until he can find fault with anyone, scolds him/her and more often than not leaves in the middle of the hand (if you're lucky; some stay or even remove the scoldee if they are host).

Needless to say; this takes away a lot if not all the fun of playing on BBO.

 

What can we do about this?

 

- Yes, I can also play only with people I know against people I know. This would reduce my BBO-activity by 99,99 percent.

- Yes, I know I can make these people 'enemy'. Been adding such people for years (900+ on the list now) and it just keeps coming at the same rate.

- Yes, I know it is possible to report abuse. Sometimes I even do report. But even if this method always leads to the desired result, apparently the barrier to report is too high and hence the problem persists.

 

Or does my (silent) presence at a table simply evoke rude behaviour?

 

Again, what can we do about this?

Post a message to every player every time s/he logs on explaining the house rules, including sanctions?

Lower the barrier for abuse reporting? Right-click persons name, mark abuse => automatic message to abuse with a timestamp?

Assign behaviour-ratings and give option to play only rating >x?

Allow players to only play with boardcompletionrate>98?

Require members to supply their real name when they sign up?

 

Anyone?

[mgoetze]

I am surprised to see there is so little discussion on this forum about abuse in the form of rude behaviour.

 

Perhaps because...

 

- Yes, I can also play only with people I know against people I know. This would reduce my BBO-activity by 99,99 percent.

 

...other forum members are not in this situation. Maybe you should...

 

- Yes, I know I can make these people 'enemy'. Been adding such people for years (900+ on the list now) and it just keeps coming at the same rate.

 

... instead have spent your years marking 900+ as friends. Then you would have plenty to play with.

 

Of course, if you are just silent at the table, they might not want to play with you again...

[babalu1997]

matmat is systematically beheading the abusers, quartering their bodies and displaying body parts throughout the kingdom.

 

but that is a lot of work for one guy, plus he has a lot of other interests.

 

but honestly, none of your proposed solutions work.

[BunnyGo]

matmat is systematically beheading the abusers, quartering their bodies and displaying body parts throughout the kingdom.

 

Oh! He's *that* kind of troll.

[Aberlour10]

Again, what can we do about this?

Your suggestions sound not bad, but I am afraid they are impracticable in the reality of the MBC. Playing mostly random tables like you I have a (subjektive) feeling the verbal rudeness is less from year to year. Anyhow that'something.

[Bbradley62]

Yes, I can also play only with people I know against people I know. This would reduce my BBO-activity by 99,99 percent.

You should check out some of the free "private" clubs: BBO Fans, IBAA, etc. Yes, they have tournaments, not MBC play, but they take behavior seriously and blacklist violators. Playing those would also help you build your friends list.

 

Lower the barrier for abuse reporting? Right-click persons name, mark abuse => automatic message to abuse with a timestamp?

I think it would be better to have a place on the chatbox to report abuse, which would ask you who you were reporting and then send the chatbox contents to abuse@. This is how these things are reported in the AOL chatrooms.

 

Require members to supply their real name when they sign up?

I love this one, but don't see it happening.

[inquiry]

Require members to supply their real name when they sign up?

I love this one, but don't see it happening.

 

What reasonable ways do you suggest BBO use to "require" members to supply their real name? Reasonable means that everyone has access to that way of verifying who they are.

 

Credit card? Does everyone (from young people to players from certain select countries have a credit card?)

checking account?

paypal account?

 

This is a very non-trivial requirement if the goal is to maximize availability of the site. One idea might be to have a room similar to the open room that only allows people who have verified who they are, but what would happen to the rooms where anyone without verification play? Would that become even worse than the problems experienced now for the younger players etc who could not verify.

 

I like the idea of verification, I am just unaware of a workable solution to the technical problems to be overcome. Having a verified email address is not a solution given how easy it is to get "free" and unlimited new email addresses.

[Darjeeling]

All your objections make sense. I agree with most of what you all say.

 

Does this mean everything has been considered, tried and discarded - that there is simply no solution? I find it hard to believe that a place like BBO simply accepts this.

 

I see hundreds of posts about rating systems both in BBO as on the forums, with endless discussions and critiques and the most sophisticated suggestions. The expertise is absolutely there.

 

I love to just click one button and then I am whisked away to an empty seat. If I had to search for tables with only friends, exactly one empty seat, and then set the permission mode to manual I'd spent 80% of my time managing instead of playing. Do tell me if it's too much to ask for: just be spared comments that noone would dare to utter at a live table.

[hrothgar]

Do tell me if it's too much to ask for: just be spared comments that noone would dare to utter at a live table.

 

The short answer to your question is "Yes"

 

The long answer is "The cure is worse than the disease"

[MzoMadness]

I am glad I'm not the only one who feels this way! I'm new to the site, and so far I have not been to a table where I have been treated decently. I'm a beginner, and I've listed this on my profile. If I take more than a few seconds to bid, I get harrassed. I bid a little too low once, but before I could finish making my contract (which I was going to do), I was thrown out of the game and berated by the person in charge of the table. Again, this has happened at every single table I've tried, so I'm deleting my username. I have no issue with criticism, because I know I'm not an expert player and have a lot to learn, but I'm not in the business of taking garbage from people. There are other sites to play bridge- this one obviously is full of high-level players and people who don't think twice about saying exactly what's on their minds. I'm sorry I don't play at a high enough level for this website!! I wish I had a solution to the jerk behavior, but I don't see any change as long as one can go anonymously.

[JLOGIC]

Do tell me if it's too much to ask for: just be spared comments that noone would dare to utter at a live table.

 

Welcome to the internet?

[jonottawa]

I'd settle for a lack of rude behavior from yellows. When a yellow sits down at my table, my partner and I greet him and his partner, and he replies with:

 

"wonderful (not.)"

 

I understand that Fred gives his employees a lot of leeway, but I think he'd draw the line at a complete lack of common courtesy. Not that this is the first time this particular yellow has been gratuitously rude.

 

Edit 8/18. Changed 'volunteers' to 'employees' as I've been informed that the person in question is the latter.

[mgoetze]

I am glad I'm not the only one who feels this way! I'm new to the site, and so far I have not been to a table where I have been treated decently. I'm a beginner, and I've listed this on my profile. If I take more than a few seconds to bid, I get harrassed. I bid a little too low once, but before I could finish making my contract (which I was going to do), I was thrown out of the game and berated by the person in charge of the table.

 

That sucks. Were you playing in the "Main Bridge Club" or the "Relaxed Bridge Club"? If the former, I suggest you switch to the latter. Alternatively, you might want to look into the "Beginner-Intermediate-Lounge".

 

There are other sites to play bridge- this one obviously is full of high-level players

 

Oh sure, but I very much doubt you've sat at a table with one of them yet. ;)

[barmar]

Welcome to the internet?

That was basically my thought, too.

 

The online world is different from what people are used to IRL. It's been known for years that people are far ruder online. Much of it is because of anonymity, but even without it people behave badly. Seeing someone's reaction is a strong social barrier to inappropriate behavior.

 

It's not just bridge, it also happens in online discussions. Look at the comments sections of blogs, Youtube, etc. -- everything degenerates into calling someone who disagrees with you "gay".

[pooltuna]

You need to grow a thicker skin :) Silence is fine but is in itself considered rude especially to not say at a minimum "hello." Anyone who adversely comments on your play can safely assumed to be non-expert. If possible, request the host to set hand completion rate to >95% and do not play with "new", the hiding place of banned players.

[sharon j]

From Lonesome Dove "I hate rude behavior in a man.....I won't tolerate it"

[matmat]

matmat is systematically beheading the abusers, quartering their bodies and displaying body parts throughout the kingdom.

 

 

I also eat their entrails; that requires an ample supply of salt, garlic, and onion. I could possibly post a recipe, but maybe hrothgar can dig something out? possibly sous-vide?

 

JLOGIC has it. This is the internet -- you can't force people to be nice. Have you considered the possibility that your line that gets crossed is just too stringent? or the chance that you may also be considered rude by others?

 

 

Requiring a real name is unrealistic and (imo) also unwarranted. There are lots of reasons why one may wish to remain anonymous, not all are tied to logistical issues..

[shintaro]

I'd settle for a lack of rude behavior from yellows. When a yellow sits down at my table, my partner and I greet him and his partner, and he replies with:

 

"wonderful (not.)"

 

I understand that Fred gives his volunteers a lot of leeway, but I think he'd draw the line at a complete lack of common courtesy. Not that this is the first time this particular yellow has been gratuitously rude.

 

 

 

name and shame the bugger (If of course yoou have proof they said it)

[shintaro]

I am glad I'm not the only one who feels this way! I'm new to the site, and so far I have not been to a table where I have been treated decently. I'm a beginner, and I've listed this on my profile. If I take more than a few seconds to bid, I get harrassed. I bid a little too low once, but before I could finish making my contract (which I was going to do), I was thrown out of the game and berated by the person in charge of the table. Again, this has happened at every single table I've tried, so I'm deleting my username. I have no issue with criticism, because I know I'm not an expert player and have a lot to learn, but I'm not in the business of taking garbage from people. There are other sites to play bridge- this one obviously is full of high-level players and people who don't think twice about saying exactly what's on their minds. I'm sorry I don't play at a high enough level for this website!! I wish I had a solution to the jerk behavior, but I don't see any change as long as one can go anonymously.

 

 

THere are 'Friendly' sites on here if you play Acol try the Acol Club or try BIL club (Beginner Intermediate Lounge)

[MzoMadness]

Thanks to Shintaro and Mgoetze- I realize this was the clear answer to playing with people more at my experience level. Generally, I do have a thick skin IRL and have had experience with morons on the internet, but it was just a bit of a shock to see THAT much attitude right off the bat! I will definitely change my settings to the more relaxed areas of the site, now that I see that this option works.

[shintaro]

Thanks to Shintaro and Mgoetze- I realize this was the clear answer to playing with people more at my experience level. Generally, I do have a thick skin IRL and have had experience with morons on the internet, but it was just a bit of a shock to see THAT much attitude right off the bat! I will definitely change my settings to the more relaxed areas of the site, now that I see that this option works.

 

 

WElcome to BBO Good luck and above all enjoy your Bridge ignore the Morons

 

:)

[jonottawa]

Well, I've seen bad moderation before, but I have to admit, tonight's tournament took the cake:

 

player Number 1: p..please faster...this hand is very easy

player Number 1: p..please faster

Player 2: he has 9 minutes

player Number 1: nobody asked for your opinion

->jonottawa: Director zego_7 has been requested by jonottawa

->jonottawa: Director zego_7 is now at the table as requested by jonottawa

Player 2: you are not supposed to talk to your p

jonottawa: hi, dummy is saying faster faster

zego_7: hi problem ?

jonottawa: and then when my partner said 'he has 9 minutes' he replied 'nobody asked for your opinion'

player Number 1: yes.......

jonottawa: I find his behavior very rude

player Number 1: idiot

jonottawa: and he just private texted me

player Number 1: keep silent idiot

jonottawa: 'idiot'

Player 2: he is not supposed to instruct his p

jonottawa: 'keep silent idiot'

player Number 1: you keep silent

player Number 1: west is offending me

player Number 1: idiot

->jonottawa: You have been replaced, and are no longer playing in this tournament/team game

->DIRECTOR XX: what just happened?

player Number 1: lol....poor idiot

player Number 1: idiot..now play alone

->DIRECTOR XX: hello?

player Number 1: you must learn to talk only when asked

player Number 1: dont make stupid interventions!!!.....poor IDIOT

->DIRECTOR XX: are you there?

DIRECTOR XX: yes

->DIRECTOR XX: why was I banned from the tournament?

->DIRECTOR XX: my opponent was calling me an idiot, why did you ban me?

DIRECTOR XX: i see you was rud

->DIRECTOR XX: I was quoting his private message to me

->DIRECTOR XX: please reinstate me, I did nothing rude

DIRECTOR XX: i dont see but see what you say

->DIRECTOR XX: what I said was in quotes, I was quoting his private message to me

->DIRECTOR XX: please ban the player I complained about and reinstate me

 

At that point the tournament director stopped talking to me.

 

Edit: I would like to add that once I got a hold of DIRECTOR YY, she took care of the problem ASAP and I am grateful for that. She does a fantastic job.

Edited August 26, 2011 by inquiry
removal of player and director names as they are not here to defend themselves or verify the above is an accurate representation of what happened. Standard edit (or delete) by terms of service policy

[jonottawa]

So I finally get reinstated in the tournament by the chief director and arrive at my table:

 

Just my luck, the rude BBO employee I mentioned earlier is my opponent:

 

jonottawa: hi opps we play my profile

RANDOM PLAYER->Tournament: no but it shows coming inland big time

RANDOM PLAYER 2->Tournament: Juan, sos un lancero

REPORTED TO BE A YELLOW: I do NOT greet rude ppl

 

Unbelievable ...

Edited August 26, 2011 by inquiry
see reason for post above this. I suspect the reported to be yellow is not a fan of jonottawa or his partner. Edit for TOS issues

[Free]

It would be useful if we could send screenshots, that way you could send a screenshot proving what your opponent told you in private. It would solve similar issues, because it can be confusing when you quote rude language like jonottawa.

[inquiry]

It would be useful if we could send screenshots, that way you could send a screenshot proving what your opponent told you in private. It would solve similar issues, because it can be confusing when you quote rude language like jonottawa.

 

You can send screenschot to abuse, of others, including any yellow. I would delete screenshots posted here because of potential missing content. It has happened that someone has insulted opponents, and then taken screenshots of their opponents reply after either hitting F6 first, or scrolling so their content is missing. Abuse is the real place to send screenshoots. So let's not bother fred or uday with them unless things are really, really out of control.