kgr Posted July 21, 2011 Report Share Posted July 21, 2011 [hv=pc=n&s=skq9832hdkqj432c2&d=w&v=0&b=8&a=1cp1h]133|200|MP's[/hv]Just curious what you would bid at MP's.I know of two bids that happened in the room:4H and 4NT: You can assume that both show a 2-suiter S/D. 4H leaves 4S open & 4NT preempts more.What would you do? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ArtK78 Posted July 21, 2011 Report Share Posted July 21, 2011 I find the two bids mentioned - 4♥ and 4NT - to be exceedingly strange. I would bid 2NT, but a case can be made for 1♠ followed by diamonds at whatever level necessary, or 2♦ followed by spades at whatever level necessary. There is no reason to assume that the opps will necessarily bid over 4♠, so 4NT seems unduly precipitous. That said, I want to get both of my suits into the auction as soon as possible. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
han Posted July 21, 2011 Report Share Posted July 21, 2011 If 4H shows these two suits then I consider it the best option. Why is it exceedingly strange Art? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
andy_h Posted July 21, 2011 Report Share Posted July 21, 2011 What about 2NT? I think 4H should be natural. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
whereagles Posted July 21, 2011 Report Share Posted July 21, 2011 2NT is normal. Later on force to at least 4♠ and you're done. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TWO4BRIDGE Posted July 21, 2011 Report Share Posted July 21, 2011 When opps have bid 2 suits and you are in 4th seat, the lowest suit ( aka LHO or in this case: Opener's suit ) is the Micheals bid . If you bid Responder's suit ( RHO ), it is natural. Hence, there is a case that 4H is natural. So for this hand, 2C! is Michaels or 2NT!... both showing the unbid suits. Also, 4C! is Michaels. Pick one . I think I'd bid 4C! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wank Posted July 21, 2011 Report Share Posted July 21, 2011 playing 4♣ or 4♥ as anything but natural seems bizarre Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
semeai Posted July 21, 2011 Report Share Posted July 21, 2011 I'd play at least 2♣, 2♥, 4♥, 5♣ as natural. I suppose at the 3-level they might be western cues. Not sure about 4♣, but best not to bid it then. Here I'd bid 2NT. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AlexJonson Posted July 21, 2011 Report Share Posted July 21, 2011 Thanks for 4NT showing my suits, I'll take it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MrAce Posted July 21, 2011 Report Share Posted July 21, 2011 If you guys believe 4♣ is natural, then how come 4 NT is not minors ? Assume u held same hand with minors 6-6... If 4♥ showing this hand i wld take it, and there is no reason to debate this hand any further imo, but without any agreements , we have to find a way to bid this in a manner that avoids accidents/misunderstandings etc.. -1NT = open to misunderstanding if not agreed -2♣/2♥ = same - DBL = has the risk of being converted -3♣/3♥ = same as 1 and 2 ♥ -4♣/4♥ = same -4♠ = better than any of the above without an agreement but flawed -4NT = I explained above, can mislead. -1♠ = Under the circumstances and agreements that are not made, i choose this one by far better than any of the above and plan to bid my ♦ later at 5 level. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
the hog Posted July 22, 2011 Report Share Posted July 22, 2011 I would bid 2NT and then force to 4S. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mike777 Posted July 22, 2011 Report Share Posted July 22, 2011 [hv=pc=n&s=skq9832hdkqj432c2&d=w&v=0&b=8&a=1cp1h]133|200|MP's[/hv]Just curious what you would bid at MP's.I know of two bids that happened in the room:4H and 4NT: You can assume that both show a 2-suiter S/D. 4H leaves 4S open & 4NT preempts more.What would you do? 4s mp is a bit of a poker game, yes? but I understand those who pick 2nt. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cloa513 Posted July 22, 2011 Report Share Posted July 22, 2011 4s mp is a bit of a poker game, yes? but I understand those who pick 2nt.4♠ is reasonable- partner to bid six with two aces including the ace of trumps after its strange to bid 4 without the ace of trumps. But change either suit to include the Ace and 2NT is a winner. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kgr Posted July 22, 2011 Author Report Share Posted July 22, 2011 I said that 4H and 4NT shows this 2-suiter, so it is not clear for me why you all think this shows something else for us. (We also play that 1NT, 2C, 2H, 2NT, 3C, 3H, ....show specific 2-suiters. Probably not best, but that is what we do).I did bid 4NT and we ended in 5D. Partner had a ♠x and ♦Ax. Both 4♠ and 5♦ (without a ♦-lead) make thanks to ♠ being 3-3. Opps had a save in 5♥-2, but that was difficult to find even without preempting them. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
han Posted July 22, 2011 Report Share Posted July 22, 2011 I also don't understand the comments. If the OP says that 4H and 4NT show these two suits, then those are the agreements to be used. Of course we can comment on the quality of those agreements. (I agree that 4H should be natural, and using 2H, 3H and 4H all as artificial seems really questionable.) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
the hog Posted July 22, 2011 Report Share Posted July 22, 2011 I said that 4H and 4NT shows this 2-suiter, so it is not clear for me why you all think this shows something else for us. (We also play that 1NT, 2C, 2H, 2NT, 3C, 3H, ....show specific 2-suiters. Probably not best, but that is what we do).I did bid 4NT and we ended in 5D. Partner had a ♠x and ♦Ax. Both 4♠ and 5♦ (without a ♦-lead) make thanks to ♠ being 3-3. Opps had a save in 5♥-2, but that was difficult to find even without preempting them. Well, if BOTH 4H AND 4NT show this hand, I have no idea why you did not bid 4H. If partner has a S fit and not a D fit you are forcing to 5S! Also I see no logic in having 2 bids showing the same hand. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
han Posted July 22, 2011 Report Share Posted July 22, 2011 Yes, 4NT is really weird. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
andy_h Posted July 22, 2011 Report Share Posted July 22, 2011 I guess it is just semantics but I understood the OP saying that they know two types of actions taken with this hand around the room (not necessarily the OP's system) and asked how we would bid with this hand as opposed to which of these two actions would we pick from. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
benlessard Posted July 22, 2011 Report Share Posted July 22, 2011 I dont believe 4H should be natural, 2H & 3H i agree but not 4H. A huge 2 suiter in position like is more frequent that RHO has psyched and i have a 4H bid (or that rho didnt psych and i have a 4H bid) The 2 suiter bid at 4H rather than 4C give more preemption in a spot where its really important. Having the 4H hand you still can pass and bid 4H, you lose preemption but in a spot where its less important since if rho psyched its because hes got a hube club fit anyway. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
billw55 Posted July 22, 2011 Report Share Posted July 22, 2011 When opps have bid 2 suits and you are in 4th seat, the lowest suit ( aka LHO or in this case: Opener's suit ) is the Micheals bid . If you bid Responder's suit ( RHO ), it is natural. Hence, there is a case that 4H is natural. So for this hand, 2C! is Michaels or 2NT!... both showing the unbid suits. Also, 4C! is Michaels. Pick one . I think I'd bid 4C!Why are three different bids needed to show the two suiter? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ArtK78 Posted July 22, 2011 Report Share Posted July 22, 2011 If 4H shows these two suits then I consider it the best option. Why is it exceedingly strange Art?I find it exceedingly strange for 4♥ to show spades and diamonds and 4NT to show spades and diamonds, especially when 2NT clearly shows spades and diamonds. As others have mentioned, I don't know why you need so many bids to show the same hand (aside from the fact that the 4NT bid forces us to 5♠ if partner has a preference for spades). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pooltuna Posted July 22, 2011 Report Share Posted July 22, 2011 In view of all the confusion surrounding Qbids and no meta-agreements in place I would just overcall 1♠ planning on a ♦ rebid. As a possible meta-agreement I would use after both opponents have called different suits I would use "Michaels not applicable" and Sandwich NT instead of natural. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MrAce Posted July 22, 2011 Report Share Posted July 22, 2011 I find it exceedingly strange for 4♥ to show spades and diamonds and 4NT to show spades and diamonds, especially when 2NT clearly shows spades and diamonds. Why 2 NT is clearly showing ♠+♦? What do u do with this or similar hands ? x xKQxxxAQT9xx Han did not say he thinks thats what 4♥ shows, he said IF thats what it shows he would take it, so does everyone, no ? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
xxhong Posted July 22, 2011 Report Share Posted July 22, 2011 It is a 3NT bid to show 6-6. If you play 3NT as to play, then you may have a problem to show 6-6, in that case I might just bid 1S. 2NT then raise partner's 3 level bid should show a strong hand with 6-5. Also, I don't really like 4NT here. 4H should show a spade suit and quite serious. Hands like AKQxxxxx AJx xx - Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Join the conversation
You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.