How you play with a expert

[spwdo]

Hi,

 

After having the priv. to be able to pair up with some really really good player once in a while i was wondering how other less talented or shortley started players feel when they pair up with a excellent player.

 

A lot where given that oppertunity recentley in the BIL festivities(well done Maureen and co again) so maybe some will be voted or adding acomment.

 

Another reason i make this poll is that i often encounter Experts(maybe self proclaimed donno) that causes problems in one way or the other(mostley disconnecting/arguining after partners mistakes) .

One(a player, not a td) told me recentley he had 173 experts in his blacklist with whom he woud never play again cause they stunk he said so maybe some have same experience.

 

Last reason is after seeing the experts explaining how they play with a "godzilla"in a indy it seems only fair to let the B/I given a voice too :) in how they feel in same situation.

 

Please add comments

 

Regards

 

Marc

[Chamaco]

I think that many discussions arise after abnormal play/bids, and that often such abnormal decisions are a consequence of such attempts to modify commonsense situations in the light of what you expect from pard.

 

I believe it is wiser to play/bid as I usually do: at least if I do a mistake and someone blames me, the mistake is genuine ! :)

[guggie]

Firstly, if I play with someone who calls himself an expert I dont care as this doesnt mean anything. When I play with someone I rate to be an expert i do my utmost best and play much better than normally, counting frenzylike and so on, because i do not want to make silly mistakes, and I hope the expert will play another time with me.

When I play with experts who are anonymous, I give them a heart;-)

(I had the privilege to play 2 hands with Smispi in an indy - did I know - and he still carries a heart with the text: this man CAN play).

 

By the way I rated myself down from advanced to intermediate, this shows a lot of profit won by sloppy defense of opps who despise you. I seriously consider to move on to novice.

[whereagles]

It depends a bit on the relation between the two players. If it's a lesson, just play by the book and follow the expert's discards. If they're both there just to win, don't overbid or make ambiguous bids. Just play straight down the middle and let him take the difficult decisions.

[bearmum]

playing with "experts" here on BBO I find LOTS would be pushing to win a tournament at a social club ( :ph34r: ) so if I find folks I really dislike (and maybe it's more to do with their behaviour at the table rather than claiming "expert" when they are not) I make a note for myself on their profile.

 

I have not been priveledged to play with a "star" or a "WC" player (and probably will never do so) but IF I ever did I would expect that partner would realise I'm only an Intermediate and be willing to play the system and conventions I am comfortable with, and HOPE that I would learn something from the experience

 

IMHO a WORLD class players are those that win not because of esoteric sysyems and conventions BUT because they

1. LISTEN to the bidding

2. Count the cards

3. Watch EVERY card played and

4 know HOW to play certain card combinations ( sometimes against the "right" way having taken into account the first three points ) :lol:

[keylime]

When I play with a legitimate expert I notice there are a few things that they do. I'm going to use my experiences with Ben to help picture it for everyone.

 

1. A true expert takes his/her time BEFORE playing to the first trick. They NEVER say "faster please", unless it's so obvious that something's up. They understand the concept of planning.

 

2. A true expert appreciates not the A's and K's, but the tens, nines, and eights of a hand.

 

3. A true expert tries their hardest to help PARTNER out, and tries to understand what partner is doing, or not doing, in defense.

 

4. A true expert is comfortable with styles of play, and adjusts accordingly. Specific conventions are not nearly as important as getting to the bottom line.

 

5. Lastly, a true expert doesn't criticize partner. Instead, they get it right. And they NEVER EVER EVER give lessons at the table, regardless of how right or wrong they are.

 

There's the standards....now let's see the TRUE experts step forward.

[sceptic]

Beginner, expert, world class, intermediate or advanced, I play badly with them all.

 

Hope this is an constructive opinion Marc

[luke warm]

in a recent acbl we played against an 'expert' opponent... they stopped in 3M one hand, when 4 was laydown... the 'expert' said, "partner how can you bid this way, you are a rank beginner!!"

 

that wasn't an expert

[jtfanclub]

I'm a little more agressive when they have to play it, and a little less agressive when I'm going to be playing it. I also trust their signals a lot more than the average person.

[han]

In real life I sometimes get the opportunity to play with players that are much better than I am. I don't think that I play very differently then, perhaps I'm more motivated then usual. However, I ask more questions after hands, and usually I have lots of stuff to think about afterwards.

[whereagles]

The ability to think about the consequences of one's acts is the most valuable gift one can have :P

[the hog]

I like Helen Sobel's answer when asked what it was like to play with an expert. Her reply, "Ask my partner". She was playing with Charles Goren at the time.

[lexica]

It is rather late so I guess a bit of plagiarising is Ok...

First off, an expert is an expert is an expert is..... Used to be scared; went thru the "did you like to pull cats' tails way back?" stage; love to learn but sometimes negative experience is just as precious (for character building and bridge-burning purposes; hardly constructive for bridge learning, however); it is always TOO late to say BIG THANK YOU to the people - experts big and not so - who have helped you... In other words "others" seemed like the only way to capture a mixed bag of feelings, experiences and attitudes.

Second, what's in a name, hence what is an "expert"? Uday's definition is hardly viable, "common sense" definition is always already subjective and easier to psychoanalyse than pinpoint so where does that get us?

Third... huh... Life is very short for fussing and fighting... Pity ego-trips take at least two to be a fulfilling experience; without them there would be much less collateral damage and much more fun playing but I might be wrong. Anyway, hate to play with an unknown expert at an indy. Unless in a pranky mood (just in case).

Until the criteria for an "expert" are clear-cut, playing with one is like playing a russian roullette: if you know him/her and you like him/her, it might be fun and no precautions would be necessary; if you don't - well, then it's pot-luck. Either way, for what do we live, but to make sport for our neighbours, and laugh at them in our turn?

B)

[helene_t]

When playing with an expert, I ask for advice everytime something goes wrong ... I trust that if the correct answer to my question is "we did the right thing, just happened to be wrong with this split", then I will get that answer.

[the hog]

Ask my pd.

[inquiry]

First, thanks keylime for the nice comment...

 

Second, when I play with an expert, I feel overjoyed. It is an opportunity for me to practice drawing inferences from the the bidding or play that can be sound. It is an opportunity for me to have hands to look back over where I am pretty darn certain when somethiing went wrong it was my fault, and I can try to figure out what I did wrong (did I lead the expert astray with the wrong spot card to trick 3? Did I underbid, did I miss a bid that would have described my hand better, etc).

 

As for the option on the poll, I am I scared? No.

Do I hope no one shows up to kibtiz? Of course not, I love kibitzing and kibitzers

Do I do whatever I can to let partner play the hands? No. Rather I am playing with novice or pro, I don't try to play ot let hem play the major of thiem.. I bid normally.

Do I hpe I get a good pointer or two? I always hope that... I am just not a fan of lessons "at the table"... I learn form takehome homework after the session is over.

Wrorry about the over inflated rating on BBO? Nope, I know who are and are not experts, I don't even look at the self ratings...

 

So, when I play with an expert what do I feel like? I feel like having FUN.. and you know what, that is waht I feel like when I play with novices, beginners, advance, and intermediates as well. And for me not to have fun, my partner has to be a boor and/or rude, skill level is not the issue. So be sarcastic, rude, or bothersome, and you will find that I leave fairly quickly. Make blunder after blunder, but take it in good spirits, and we can have fun playing all day. After all, at one time (and occassionaly still), I made blunder after blunder myself, and my partners still played with me.

 

Ben

[luke warm]

i agree with ben, playing with an expert is just plain fun... i don't worry about my forcing bids being passed (tho on occasion i do worry about passing one :rolleyes:)

 

i don't have to worry about being "resulted" (God i hate that)... i don't have to worry about having 3 opponents, i always know my partner is *really* on my team... i always know that if i'm to receive instruction (at the table, in public), it's usually because i asked for it

 

and lastly, playing with an expert shows me more of my own potential, and that's always a good thing

[hench]

there are so many experts and world class players in bbo, but most of them are not playing so good.

[Laird]

Hello All

 

I have to my knowledge only once played with a World Class Expert (Fred) in the recent BIL celebrations. When I learned I was to be given this privilege I was naturally nervous about it and had to overcome all the usual fears.

 

I hope I dont make a fool of myself,

 

I hope I dont let Fred down,

 

I hope I can remember the cards that were played, what about signals and all these Kibbers watching... pressure... pressure ... pressure

 

However when you calm down and rationalise the situation ... Its only a game nothing is at stake all these imagined pressures are really self imposed.

 

The actual game was smashing ... Fred was a gentleman and the ops were Byroner and Cascade both easy to play with and fun. Many of the Kibs also offered good wishes and voiced encouragement and this was uplifting too.

Again evidence that these pressures were self imposed....

 

BIL to my mind is excellent in preparing you to meet these pressures. The real experts and advanced players who are willing to give of their time and expertise in the lounge and pass on the basics of this wonderful game is the standard I use to gauge others.

 

Whilst to my knowledge I have only played once with a world class player I have frequently played against experts and it is fun when you occasionally manage to defend successfully against them and you see them arguing away, usually in a language other than English about what they should have done.

 

Perhaps in the near future as more BIL members gain more knowledge and experience it will be only fair to experts and advanced alike to have a warning sign on your profile ... Be Careful ... BIL member :)

 

Laird