ATB

[quiddity]

[hv=pc=n&s=sa4hdj82cakqj9754&w=sjt96h9732dak96ct&n=skq87hj65d743c862&e=s532hakqt84dqt5c3&d=e&v=n&b=2&a=1h3h(stopper%20ask)4hpp5cdppp&p=dad3dtd8dkd4d5djh7]399|300[/hv]

 

Agreements: udca, A=att K=count at the 5 level.

 

Bidding questions:

- If west doubles 3♥ instead, what does that show?

- What should the double of 5♣ show? Is it primarily penalty, or is it a suggestion to bid? If west's hand is too weak to double, how much stronger should it be?

- Should east pull?

 

Play questions:

- Should west lead the king instead?

- Should east encourage with the queen?

- Is there a way for west to know the correct play at trick 3?

[olegru]

Question: By EW agreements if E would have 1052 would he discard 10 than 5, 10 than 2 ot 5 than 2?

[helene_t]

In general, a double of a bid in our suit shows values and some interest in defending. Not sure if that is best here, a constructive raise may be more frequent. Anyway, I would take it as showing defensive values unless agreed otherwise.

 

The double of 5♣ is not penalty. Somewhat depending on what (if any) other raises West had, I think dbl should show that the 4♥ bid was sound and that the hand has some defensive values also. E should certainly pull.

 

I dunno if W should have lead the king but on this deal I think leading the ace makes it easier. East knows that it can do no harm to continue diamonds since if W has the ace of spades it is no rush to cash the heart trick (which EW might have, from East's perspective), and if W does not have ♠A (on the bidding S is probably marked with ♠A) then the only chance of defeating the contract is that we get at least two diamond tricks. If E encourages then W knows that E has at least three diamonds (he would not encourage from T5 I suppose) so if W has five diamonds he will know that S can ruff and he will switch to a heart despite E encouraging diamonds.

[quiddity]

Question: By EW agreements if E would have 1052 would he discard 10 than 5, 10 than 2 ot 5 than 2?

 

Undiscussed. In general East would try to give the clearest possible signal assuming it can't blow a trick. We haven't discussed second-round signals but I would guess the default is upside-down count.

[semeai]

Bidding questions:

- If west doubles 3♥ instead, what does that show?

- What should the double of 5♣ show? Is it primarily penalty, or is it a suggestion to bid? If west's hand is too weak to double, how much stronger should it be?

- Should east pull?

 

1) Double of 3♥ would be a heart raise that doesn't want to commit to 4♥. For example, it could suggest sacrificing in 4♥ over 3NT without committing to it.

2) Double of 5♣ is penalty. It does imply some strength given the sound of the auction, though. That is, probably West was bidding 4♥ to make instead of sacrificing with a weak hand (he can't have a trump stack!). Thus East may pull more often than calling it "penalty" suggests. I wouldn't double with this West hand.

3) At imps at least I'd say yes, given the complete lack of defense (the sixth heart especially).

 

Play questions:

- Should west lead the king instead?

- Should east encourage with the queen?

- Is there a way for west to know the correct play at trick 3?

 

1) My first thought was yes. On this hand, though, it would leave you on a guess of how many hearts partner has and whether he has the ♦Q. That is, declarer could be 2-1-3-7 with the ♦Q. You don't want to lead 3 diamonds and give away the contract. The conclusion is I'm not sure. (Added: The 2-1-3-7 hand isn't relevent, as partner can't be AKQ10x and out.)

2) Yes. It's doubtful partner has 3 hearts, so you have no useful cards in your hand other than the ♦Q.

3) Yes, I think so. Declarer played the J and 8 of diamonds. Partner would have played 10 and then 2 with Q1052. I suppose this is declarer's error and he should play J and 2 it seems.

 

Added: I seem to have it all wrong. I missed the udca comment, and thought East had encouraged. Will rethink and edit shortly.

 

New analysis: 2 as above.

3) Declarer's J and 8 make partner's holding unclear. Given that partner discouraged, I would play him for a heart trick. If he has the spade ace, it doesn't matter.

[nigel_k]

On what layout is it right for East to discourage diamonds?

[quiddity]

On what layout is it right for East to discourage diamonds?

 

Ok, I think you're right. How about the bidding and the lead?

[whereagles]

This isn't easy at all. In fact, it seems pretty nigh impossible to sort it out because you'd need a signal that shows encouragement AND count :)

 

If you lead the ace, opener's 2nd round signal will be the ♦T, which is consistent with a left-over doubleton or tripleton. The king lead works here, but it's very easy to make a layout where it fails, so I say forget this hand and move on. There will always be some guessing in this game.

[han]

I would lead the king. I tend to assume that the ace denies the king at the 5-level, so I would be afraid that partner signals negative holding the queen anyway.

 

After the lead of the king, east would play the 10, and then on the ace, the 5. Declarer would have to hide the 2 of diamonds, since partner would play the 8 on the second round from 1085 and the jack on the first round from J105.

 

If declarer does it right, west has a guess.

[benlessard]

I dont think this is a problem.

 

1- Its not a situation for unsupported A. If they end up in 3NT after one of the player showed a great suit, slam or south showed a void than i could understand but here West has no reason to lead to lead an unsupported A when his partner has opened and showed a suit. (unless he want to ruff /give a ruff).

 

Try to find a hand for west where leading an unsupported A make sense.

 

 

2- Why would west lead the K(asking for count) with 4D and 4H ? He he will quickly get an approzimation of the number of H trick he can expect. Knowing who has the Q or if partner got a xx is way more important.

 

3- On a A lead its a WTP. With 3D and 6H east as an easy encourage and with 5H /4D an easy discourage.