Developing Bidding Judgement

[hotShot]

Bridge judgment means that you "have an idea" or even "know" what you could do with the cards in your hand.

 

That is why the judgment comes with good declarer play.

 

So you need to play as declarer a lot, but it is useless if you don't analyze what you have done.

 

If you are a beginner and play with beginners you will often find, that you have reached the same number of tricks as the good players.

But you need to realize that this does not mean, that you played well, it just means that your opps returned every gift you gave them.

 

So if you want to benefit from playing a lot, you need good opps, that will take advantage of every mistake you make or a good teacher who can explain to you what you did wrong.

If you don't have good opps available, in real life allow your opps to look into each others cards.

If you have a software available, that can show you step by step which of your moves would have given away a trick, use it to analyze your play.

 

Once your declarer play improves your judgment will follow and you will find, that when you understand what the declarer is about to do, your defense will have improved as well.

[Free]

One of the weakest solutions I've read here is to watch good players. Watching doesn't work imo because you don't know why the good player takes several actions. Understanding is one thing, applying is another, but if you don't understand it you'll never be able to apply it. Personally I don't learn anything from watching bridge on vugraph for example, I just enjoy to see how they're bidding and playing their cards, but that's it.

 

It's already been said that you need a good mix between playing and studying. You need to study to learn about some patterns and situations, but you need to play to recognize them and apply your knowledge. Also try to learn from your mistakes (and successes). When I'm not happy about a choice I've made, I prefer to start a poll here on the forums to see what arguments people use for their choice. Perhaps they have another perspective on the situation that I've completely missed, which makes me understand why my choice was wrong or right.

 

What is most important however is to have good partnership understanding. I don't mean conventions of all sorts, but you need to know what partner's bids mean and vice versa. You can play any style from hyper agressive to ultra sound, as long as both players have the discipline not to deviate from it too much too often. When playing a lot with 1 partner you'll acquire some sort of bidding judgement (same when playing some specific system) which is typical for this partnership. If you play with someone else you might have to adapt your bidding judgement because of differences in style. Bidding judgement has to be flexible.

[Phil]

The right ratio of study / play varies depending on the person, however, I will say the shorter someone has played, the higher the % of study is required. Unless you are some savant, endings and themes are extremely difficult to work out at the table if you haven't seem them before. I will say that playing is a great way to practice your counting however.

 

I think those that advocate that playing > studying have to ask themselves if they are properly analyzing the hands in the post-mortem and trying to improve their game. Unless you have a mentor, or a feedback process via peers, how are you ever determining that what you are doing at the table is correct?

[Vampyr]

The right ratio of study / play varies depending on the person, however, I will say the shorter someone has played, the higher the % of study is required. Unless you are some savant, endings and themes are extremely difficult to work out at the table if you haven't seem them before. I will say that playing is a great way to practice your counting however.

 

I think those that advocate that playing > studying have to ask themselves if they are properly analyzing the hands in the post-mortem and trying to improve their game. Unless you have a mentor, or a feedback process via peers, how are you ever determining that what you are doing at the table is correct?

 

Well, most duplicate games/tournament sessions are followed by a free-for-all feedback session at the bar, aren't they? :rolleyes:

 

Playing online can be very helpful too, because you can take a record of every bid on every hand. This can be useful for self-study, as you can see exactly how different bidding decisions led to good/fair/poor contracts.

[whereagles]

playing a lot is obviously good for developing judgement, but reading a couple of books helps... otherwise you'll be wasting much time discovering things you could have learned in 5 minutes if you had read them :)

 

mike lawrence's "hand evaluation" is a nice book for starters.

[jogs]

Play a natural system. Play as few conventions as possible. No blackwood of any form. Use cue bidding.

[Vampyr]

Play a natural system. Play as few conventions as possible. No blackwood of any form. Use cue bidding.

 

Yes, this will help a lot; does someone know how to find the other thread where this idea was discussed? If it were up to me I would allow Blackwood, along with Stayman and Truscott.

[matmat]

Yes, this will help a lot; does someone know how to find the other thread where this idea was discussed? If it were up to me I would allow Blackwood, along with Stayman and Truscott.

 

 

you're probably referring to this one: Beginners Improve

 

I would amend the statement you quote though to : "play whatever the simplest version of the system in your area is."

 

if you are in the land of precision you may find it difficult to get any good/useful advice about SAYC or 2/1 or whatnot.

 

Also have to make a distinction between playing conventions and learning them. Sure, it is probably best to keep complicated stuff out of your agreements with partner, at least initially, but the more stuff you know, the better it is for your game (from the defensive and listening-as-you-go-learning standpoints).

[jogs]

Yes, this will help a lot; does someone know how to find the other thread where this idea was discussed? If it were up to me I would allow Blackwood, along with Stayman and Truscott.

 

Blackwood is both overused and misused. This happens all the time. One player Blackwoods. After hearing partner's response, he tanks before placing the contract. That means he had no business using Blackwood. Knowing the number of aces wasn't the most critical piece of info. Often one needs to know which ace.

 

Don't remember Truscott. Wasn't aware that this was commonly played.

 

Stayman is necessary. I like Jacoby.

 

Don't need Bergen, Drury or any of the other stuff.

[Vampyr]

you're probably referring to this one: Beginners Improve

 

No, not this one. There was another thread in which the idea of improving one's judgment and thought processes through playing very simple systems was discussed.

[Vampyr]

Blackwood is both overused and misused. This happens all the time.

 

It is also properly used. This happens all the time too. It's a useful tool to have at one's disposal if used with care. Like an electric drill.

 

 

Don't remember Truscott.

 

This is a convention whereby 1z-(X)-2NT shows an invitational hand with support in z. It is one of the most useful conventions around and one which gives very little from doing away with the natural meaning of the bid.

[matmat]

This is a convention whereby 1z-(X)-2NT shows an invitational hand with support in z. It is one of the most useful conventions around and one which gives very little from doing away with the natural meaning of the bid.

 

this or a variant of it is called jordan 2n in acbl land, i think?

[blackshoe]

Some call it Jordan, some call it Truscott. I think there's another name for it as well (Dormer?)

[aguahombre]

does someone know how to find the other thread where this idea was discussed?

I remember that the thread was started by a self-professed novice who stated he, and his partner were interested in how to develope together. The thread broached play of the hands, vs defense, vs bidding system. Seems it was from 6-months to a year ago.

 

Would that help anyone find it? It didn't help me.

[jogs]

 

 

Playing online can be very helpful too, because you can take a record of every bid on every hand. This can be useful for self-study, as you can see exactly how different bidding decisions led to good/fair/poor contracts.

 

Also view the hand histories. See how everyone else bid and played the board.

[mtvesuvius]

OK Well I did a bunch of searches, and don't think I turned up the one Vampyr was looking for, but there were several good threads and a post by Fred on improving your bridge that I turned up as well:

 

This is JLOGIC on concentration/improving thought processes:

http://www.bridgebase.com/forums/topic/43870-why-can-i-not-think-better/page__p__522843__hl__improve__fromsearch__1#entry522843

 

More stuff on improving your game, and some mention of natural bidding etc, here:

http://www.bridgebase.com/forums/topic/35245-beginner-looking-for-guidance/page__p__407879__hl__improve__fromsearch__1#entry407879

 

Study vs Playing:

http://www.bridgebase.com/forums/topic/41664-study-versus-play/page__p__495750__hl__improve__fromsearch__1#entry495750

 

Fred made a post in one of Kenrexford's threads about some wild auction in response to blackshoe's question, which is well written and seems to summarize a lot of the stuff in this thread:

 

I am sorry, but the only good books I know of on this subject were written more than 50 years ago. Probably for some they would still be interesting to read, but the game has changed so much since then that I expect most non-experts reading such books (if they could even find a copy) would end up becoming confused.

 

I see most of today's books about bidding as analogous to those spam-like ads "work part time from your home and earn $100,000+ per year!" or "eat all the chocolate you want and never gain any weight!". Most modern books on bidding I have seen are nothing but hype and what they are hyping is some bidding system or collection of conventions that will "improve your results by 10% without you having to learn the basics!".

 

Here is what I would suggest:

 

Don't give a great deal of consious thought to this subject in your first few years of serious play. Learn a simple bidding system and only the few conventions that are so popular that they have essentially become part of "standard bidding" (unfortunately there are now quite a few conventions that fall into this category).

 

Keep your mind uncluttered with conventions that you don't really understand and play as many hands as possible, ideally with either a keen regular partner who is at roughly the same level as you or with a much better player who understands that it will help you more to spend your time discussing concepts like "a jump shift is forcing to game but a reverse is not" rather than the latest flavor of modified DONT.

 

Your brain is a remarkable machine. You will learn a lot of what is important by osmosis, especially if you manage to avoid distractions (like trying to come up with the best possible scheme of rescues when the 10-12 1NT opening that you shouldn't be using get doubled).

 

If you can afford to hire a professional player to be your partner or to give you online lessons (or whatever) you should do so, but do not hire anyone unless they are highly recommended by a person you trust and respect. If the pro or teacher starts by telling you that you must learn to play "4 of our minor is always 1430 Keycard Blackwood with specialized followups to the trump Queen ask" then find someone else - this person is trying to sell you snake oil.

 

After each session you play you should think about the hands and talk them over with your partner. If your partner is at the same level as you, try to make friends with an experienced player who is willing to discuss the hands you are not sure about (and who is the type of player whose idea of good advice does not involve teaching you that you would not have had a problem if you used his preferred variety of Extended 2-way Reverse Drury).

 

If you are fortunate enough to have access to an experienced player who is willing to help you, do not waste this opportunity by asking him questions that are designed to boost your ego (by trying to convince him/her to agree that your disaster on a particular hand was your partner's fault for example). LISTEN to your expert friend/teacher even if you disagree with him or her. Then THINK about it later. Do not get defensive when you are told that one of your bids was horrible. Instead try to understand what went wrong with your thinking process so that you can learn from your mistakes.

 

Once you get to the point that you consider yourself to be solid intermediate player (this should take 2 or 3 years of hard work) you should buy a subscription to The Bridge World magazine (and if you have friend who has a collection of back issues try to borrow them). Each month this magazine has a feature called The Master Solvers' Club. Read it and think about what you read. Re-read it and think about what you read.

 

You may find the other features of this magazine to be interesting as well, but it is fine if you read only The Master Solvers's Club in each issue.

 

This will help you to learn things like:

 

1) That bidding is not just an exercise in language, it is also an exercise in logic

2) How strong players apply logic to solve unfamiliar problems

3) The axioms that form the basis of this logic (which are "the basic principles of bidding theory" that I referred to in an earlier post)

4) You will also learn plenty about the language aspects of bidding, but most of these lessons will not involve learning the names and mechanics of new conventions.

5) That bidding situations in which the "right" answer is not at all clear are far from rare, regardless of how well you play.

 

This will also help you to improve your bidding judgment. Good bidding judgment is largely a function of experience. Reading what a bunch of good players have to say about a bunch of interesting bidding problems allows you to benefit from their vast experience without having to experience the same hands yourself.

 

Keep in mind that in many ways "learning the basics of bidding theory" is similar to things like "learning the basics of probability theory" or "learning the mechanics of compound squeezes" - these are all just parts of the game. On any given hand any given part of the game is unlikely to matter. You can survive (and you can certainly enjoy bridge) without learning such things.

 

All players are better at some parts of the game than others. For most parts of the game it is not necessary to be highly proficient in order to achieve reasonable results at the table.

 

Fred Gitelman

Bridge Base Inc.

www.bridgebase.com

[Vampyr]

OK Well I did a bunch of searches, and don't think I turned up the one Vampyr was looking for,

 

No, those were good but not the one I am looking for. The one I was thinking of may have been started by an OP stating that more conventions and more complicated systems means better bridge.

[mtvesuvius]

No, those were good but not the one I am looking for. The one I was thinking of may have been started by an OP stating that more conventions and more complicated systems means better bridge.

This one?

http://www.bridgebase.com/forums/topic/44497-bidding-is-80-of-bridge/page__p__530696__hl__conventions__fromsearch__1#entry530696

 

I'm out of ideas lol

[jjbrr]

This thread discusses Hamman and system vs skill, but I don't think I've read the whole thing and I don't know if it's relevant to this discussion.

[jogs]

Hi,

 

Just to have a nonbridge related example - Poker.

 

I dont play Poker, but once in a while I am watching Poker on TV.

And a comment heard very often is, that the wave of new players, that have reached

the to of the game in such a short period is due to the fact, that online makes it

easier to play / see lots of hands in a very short time.

 

But - you also need to analyze, what you are doing, and you have to do it on a

regular basis.

 

With kind regards

Marlowe

 

Many of the younger players are able to play poker multiple screens simultaneously. 4 screens means they can play about 200 hands per hour. Can't imagine anyone playing two screens of bridge. And it's really hard to play faster than 12 boards an hour. It's possible to become a strong poker player after about 12-18 months. Takes years to become a halfway decent bridge player.