Decision time

[paulg]

[hv=pc=n&s=sj7654h9dqjt76ckj&d=e&v=0&b=14&a=pp2h(weak)2n(16-18ish)4h]133|200[/hv]

One of the regular readers of my blog thinks that the rest of my audience has gone mad and wants to restore sanity to the situation. Of course, whether it is my audience's or his is yet to be determined.

 

What's your call? How strongly do you feel about your choice?

[nige1]

[hv=pc=n&s=sj7654h9dqjt76ckj&d=e&v=0&b=14&a=pp2h(weak)2n(16-18ish)4h]133|200| IMO

4♠ = 10, Double = 9, 5♦ = 6, Pass = 5. [/hv]

[gnasher]

If a takeout double is available, I do that. Otherwise I guess 4♠.

 

Now I'll go and read the blog.

[whereagles]

Dbl for take out. If pard passes that, it should be good. I hope!

[Phil]

Double. I'll give up on a 5-3 spade fit for a #.

 

I won;t give up on a 5-4 however.

[pirate22]

Well one should have a tight anti defence sys for weak 2's by opps

also a tight defence against multi 2's by opps- defence wise

and they are available..

so as i have both cannot offer an answer.

[paulg]

I am your partner, albeit for the first time in a major event, and you are certain that double is take-out.

[marcD]

Dbl. I trust partner to take dbl as take out even if undiscussed. We possibly belong in 4♠ but why should I decide for my partner ? I am actually more worried about 5D as partner may pass with some 3244 or 3253 but taking the plunge to 5♦ is too big a position for me

[Free]

Dbl seems obvious if it's takeout.

[JLOGIC]

I think 4S is super obvious

[whereagles]

You're the odd guy today, justin. Maybe I hacked your BBF account, ahah.

[paulg]

I think 4S is super obvious

Sanity of regular reader is restored, as he said the same thing and cannot believe everyone is doubling.

 

On the other hand, 4♦ was the last making contract on the actual hand and you'll get +500 by doubling. We actually got +1100 when declarer misread the spade position.

 

Partner held ♠Kx ♥AKx ♦Kxxx ♣Axxx.

[benlessard]

We are a passed hand so if your requirement for a weak 2 are low (meaning its impossible for us to have pts and 6S) our 4S partner will show 5S +5m or 5044 right ? Im a big fan of show cards double that are passed very frequently, this hand is perfect for me I X partner isnt allowed to pull to 5m. He will only pull to 4S with 4 card support and without too much soft values in H.

[gnasher]

I don't agree that 4♠ shows an alternative strain. We passed in second seat. I wouldn't open 2♠ in second on 10xxxxx x Axx Kxx or KQJ10x x QJxx xxx, but I'd want to bid 4♠ on either.

[paulg]

We are a passed hand so if your requirement for a weak 2 are low (meaning its impossible for us to have pts and 6S) our 4S partner will show 5S +5m or 5044 right ? Im a big fan of show cards double that are passed very frequently, this hand is perfect for me I X partner isnt allowed to pull to 5m. He will only pull to 4S with 4 card support and without too much soft values in H.

It is interesting to consider what one expects partner to do over 4♠ with his given hand. Does bidding 4♠ show two places as a passed hand, or can one just have three points and six spades. If they double four spades, does responder run? Should partner run?

 

Everyone has strong opinions in the post-mortem but never so easy at the table. Opponents are internationalists so they do not exactly jump up on the chair waving a flag when the choice is wrong and they double.

 

Edit: I see gnasher has given his view above as I posted this.

Edit: rereading this I saw it could be read as slightly aggressive toward benlessard. Nothing could be further from the truth and I've replaced 'you' with 'one' in the post. benlessard raised a very interesting and relevant point.

[Flameous]

I go with Justin, obv. 4♠, because I think it shows a minor here too as a passed hand.

I don't state "super obvious" though because the spades are so bad.

[Lurpoa]

[hv=pc=n&s=sj7654h9dqjt76ckj&d=e&v=0&b=14&a=pp2h(weak)2n(16-18ish)4h]133|200[/hv]

One of the regular readers of my blog thinks that the rest of my audience has gone mad and wants to restore sanity to the situation. Of course, whether it is my audience's or his is yet to be determined.

 

What's your call? How strongly do you feel about your choice?

 

 

4♠.

Looking for more seems too greedy.

[gwnn]

I thought 4♠ when I first saw the hand, but now no one will believe me.

[paulg]

My partner doubled saying that the spades looked like a four-card suit to her, especially as I might have doubled with spades and unspectacular heart holding.

[JLOGIC]

I don't agree that 4♠ shows an alternative strain. We passed in second seat. I wouldn't open 2♠ in second on 10xxxxx x Axx Kxx or KQJ10x x QJxx xxx, but I'd want to bid 4♠ on either.

 

Agreed for sure especially since I have higher standards for preempting than gnasher.

[benlessard]

The way i see it is that partner has 4 reason for bidding 2Nt rather than Xing.

 

1 hes got short spades.

 

2- hes got 2 stoppers in H

 

3- hes max (19pts for me) with 1 H stopper and hes afraid of X and raising S on 3 cards.

 

4- hes short in a m.

 

In frequency order from most to least i think its 1243.

 

If your preempt have a low requirement any 6 cards suit/ great 5 is possible than the way i like to play my X is that partner pass with every 1/2/3 and bid 4S with case 4. It also permit 4S to be 5-5 or 5044 by passed hand. People play their takeout X just too much takeout and not enough penalty often its pointless to make takeout for multiple strains when only the majors matters.

 

On this hand i would be very disappointed to be in 4S instead of 4Hx. Reaching 5D is not a consolation.

 

If we are red or have high requirement for a preempt than our 4S should be a suit playable vs a doubleton. Since the case where partner has 3S its because hes got a double stopper in H. Wich make defending more interesting.

[benlessard]

Also am i the only one to play that over a take out X partner has only 2 options here pass or 4s ?

[gnasher]

Also am i the only one to play that over a take out X partner has only 2 options here pass or 4s ?

If I think you're not playing it as a "takeout double".

 

Partner won't often do anything else, but I'd expect him to bid 4NT with 22(54), or bid a six-card minor if he's got one. Something like KQx Axx xx AQ109x should probably bid too.

[benlessard]

If I think you're not playing it as a "takeout double".

 

Partner won't often do anything else, but I'd expect him to bid 4NT with 22(54), or bid a six-card minor if he's got one. Something like KQx Axx xx AQ109x should probably bid too.

 

With these kind of hands why do you want to play 5m rather than 4Hx ? In the long run it doesnt pay to play 5m on 18-19 LOTT. (+ in the 2nd example here you have pure H holding but most of the time its going to be a soft holding wich mean 5m rate to be terrible). The same way over a 4D preempt i much prefer that my take out X is both M and partner is 100% on his own if he bid clubs. You sacrifice a suit but gain more flexibility and avoid some stupid result, it simply maximize my chance to play 4Dx , 4M in the right suit at the cost of not playing 5C.

 

 

At one point you have to decide that the X are take out but only for the unbid M.

 

(3red)-p-(5red)-X to see partner bid 6C is simply a joke.

 

For me the 4 level is perfect for that when my partner shape is somewhat limited.

[gnasher]

With these kind of hands why do you want to play 5m rather than 4Hx ? In the long run it doesnt pay to play 5m on 18-19 LOTT.

I'd want to play 5m because my double is more takeout-oriented than yours. Opposite the sort of hands on which I would make a takeout double, it's likely to be best for opener to bid when he has an offensively-oriented hand.

 

Sorry, I can't comment on the LOTT argument, because I don't understand LOTT. (Or to be precise, I don't understand people who use the LOTT.)

 

(+ in the 2nd example here you have pure H holding but most of the time its going to be a soft holding wich mean 5m rate to be terrible).

I didn't say you should bid 5♣ with a 3325 and soft heart holding. I said you should probably bid 5♣ with KQx Axx xx AQ109x.

 

At one point you have to decide that the X are take out but only for the unbid M.

 

(3red)-p-(5red)-X to see partner bid 6C is simply a joke.

I don't play takeout doubles as giving instructions - I use them to describe my hand. When I double in this sequence, it says that I have a good hand, usually with short hearts, and usually with some support for all the unbid suits. If partner thinks that opposite that he can make twelve tricks in clubs, he's welcome to say so.