spwdo Posted September 9, 2004 Report Share Posted September 9, 2004 [hv=s=sk74h973dk95ckq42]133|100|Bidding goes 1♣ 1♥3♣ (alerted as 11+) p 3♠ p ,your call?[/hv] Will add the interesting part of this later, woud like some comments how the bidding shoud go after this sequence when its responder turn to form a contract. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Free Posted September 9, 2004 Report Share Posted September 9, 2004 So what is this bidding anyway? 1♣ - (1♥) - 3♣ - pass3♠ - pass - ? Vulnerability and gametype are REALLY important here m8... B) Also the basic system, since it's quite stupid to bid 3♣ if partner doesn't promisse 4+ ♣s imo. I'll wait for more info ;) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fluffy Posted September 9, 2004 Report Share Posted September 9, 2004 4♣ we have our limit, no extras, 5♣ if 3♠ is GF for you. With 2 ♥ you could bid 4♠ since 3♣ deenies 4c major probably, but now losing first 3 tricks is too much, so you would relay on ♠3-3 to win. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
laughter Posted September 9, 2004 Report Share Posted September 9, 2004 4C. I can't think of another sensible alternative here.3NT is impossible without heart stopper.I don't want to suggest spade contract when partner may be forced early in hearts.Having bid 3C, I have already shown a hand that strong, and I am now taking a regressive bid. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
skorchev Posted September 9, 2004 Report Share Posted September 9, 2004 I'm on the minimum, I have no stopper ♥ => 4♣ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
helium Posted September 9, 2004 Report Share Posted September 9, 2004 Hi.i whould bid 4♠, but im not that proud of the bid since i have 3♥ kenneth Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Free Posted September 9, 2004 Report Share Posted September 9, 2004 Hmmm, I have a question here. If you use 3♥ as stopper ask (probably), then 3♠ should show a stopper ♥ imo. I can be wrong... We denied a 4 card ♠, so reversing now has no immediate use without a ♥ stopper imo. Perhaps I'm mistaken, but I think 3NT should be the winner here. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
luke warm Posted September 9, 2004 Report Share Posted September 9, 2004 free, if that's true what does 3S say about spades? is it asking? it must be else why not 3nt (with spade *and* heart stopper)... maybe you're right, but i'd still bid 4C... i'd be unclear on the meaning of 3S re: affirming or denying hearts (not really, i'd take it as denying :D) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
the hog Posted September 9, 2004 Report Share Posted September 9, 2004 Agree with Frederick. 3H would ask for a H stopper, so opener must have one to bid 3S, in fact probably a decent one to have the lead come through him - KQJ? 3S should be asking for a s stopper - I have denied 4S. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
laughter Posted September 10, 2004 Report Share Posted September 10, 2004 3S promising hearts stopper while asking for spades stop is a very nice inferencial bid.Still, I consider a rebid of 3NT be routine when opener holds a good hand with heart stopper. The danger of spade is quite remote here. In competitive bidding, the main stopper concern should be placed to opponent's suit.Therefore, opener, sure that we can work out he fails to bid 3NT because of a lack of stopper, can try to pinpoint his side suit strength with 3S.I guess 3S is consistent with something like:AQxx-xx-Ax-AxxxxAnyway, a firm agreement is MUCH better than an educated guess. It seems to be worth the while to discuss the meaning of various three level bids below 3NT in competition with your regular partner. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mike777 Posted September 10, 2004 Report Share Posted September 10, 2004 I am much closer to beginner than expert here. Am I missing something here?3c=11+.....This hand does not seem even close to an 11+ 3club...'bid. I have not played bridge in many years, perhaps I have misunderstood auction. But my responder hand seems much closer to less than 10 than 11+. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
laughter Posted September 10, 2004 Report Share Posted September 10, 2004 A nice point of hand evaluation. The hand is flawed in 2 ways:1. The flat shape (which is bad for NT and even worse for suit play) 2. Lack of aces. However, you have nice fitting honors and trump fits, and all your kings are working (kings are better than quacks in side suit). A good tips for hand evaluation: Consider how much worse can you have for your planned bid:You may raise to 2C just holding:xx-xxx-xxx-KQxxxSince you have 2 extra kings here, a 3C bid seems justified. Though if 3C is forcing, the partneship can easily get overboard unless the opening style is sound. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
beatrix45 Posted September 10, 2004 Report Share Posted September 10, 2004 What's the problem? I have a minimum for my bidding and no heart stop. Have to bid 4 clubs. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mike777 Posted September 10, 2004 Report Share Posted September 10, 2004 Great points. I rate your 2club example hand closer to this hand. before rating it 11+ and worth a forcing raise. Opener does not even promise 4 clubs. As for sound opening....yes, opposite a sound opening you may have slam....but other than Roth/Stone I would be more than willing to bet.....BBO players think almost any 13 cards =sound opening. In my very, very short time on BBO it seems very big guess to think opener has a "sound opening". Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
helene_t Posted September 10, 2004 Report Share Posted September 10, 2004 Never heard about this 11+ convention. Why not 2♥? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
laughter Posted September 10, 2004 Report Share Posted September 10, 2004 Perhaps you are too young, helene.As the title suggests, this hand comes from the distant past when the forcing raise is prevailing. Though I doubt whether those players of past generation would force with only 11 Hcps, unless their style of opening is sound. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
spwdo Posted September 10, 2004 Author Report Share Posted September 10, 2004 hi, More info :D Opener told in blue chat(private to opps) that 1♣ was a misbid/click, that he/she shoud have opened 1♠, then responder had to make its call and he passes?? Its not a hand played in a tourney or main so cant be looked up.Any comments now? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Free Posted September 10, 2004 Report Share Posted September 10, 2004 Since I still don't know that 1♣ was a misclick, I still bid 3NT... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
spwdo Posted September 10, 2004 Author Report Share Posted September 10, 2004 that was my conclusion as well, so why did he/she passes with a clear stopper in ♠ when as far as he/she "legally" knows 1♣ is the bid wich started the auction. Passing 3♠ can result in playing a five fit where partner holds XX or so. Now the hand was passed and contract was made ... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rebound Posted September 10, 2004 Report Share Posted September 10, 2004 For the sake of argument, I agree that 3♠ here shows spades and not hearts. Nevertheless, I will still bid 4♣ with this trashcan if the reverse is understood to be true. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
slothy Posted September 11, 2004 Report Share Posted September 11, 2004 Marc, my friend wiz the really morbid avatar, i would bid 1♥.... as it becomes apparent that that there is a major flaw in Fred's software and it allows an INSUFFICIENT bid... and the opponents are squabbling amongst themselves about how to continue with the penalty.... i shall take a peek at partners hand and bid the full value of our hands at this opportunity. Moral: Dishonesty is the best policing. Alex IBM (Insufficient Bid Mogul) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dogsbreath Posted September 11, 2004 Report Share Posted September 11, 2004 as often happens here ..i am bewlidered. :) ..i dont have an opening bid but seem to have opened and partener has launched into an impossible sequence .. is this from a late-night indy tournament? Does my p think we are playing WJ2K? cant pass, cant find a bid and am in danger of Slothy finding a spelling mistake in my post. what's the weakest way to 4C? ..bid 3nt and hope they x so i can run ? :) Rgds Dog make your mistake quickly.. or p will think you did it deliberately Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Free Posted September 11, 2004 Report Share Posted September 11, 2004 as often happens here ..i am bewlidered. :( ..i dont have an opening bid but seem to have opened and partener has launched into an impossible sequence .. is this from a late-night indy tournament? Does my p think we are playing WJ2K? cant pass, cant find a bid and am in danger of Slothy finding a spelling mistake in my post. what's the weakest way to 4C? ..bid 3nt and hope they x so i can run ? :) Rgds Dog make your mistake quickly.. or p will think you did it deliberately I think you need to read the problem again, it's your partner who opened... :) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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