LH2650 Posted March 24, 2011 Report Share Posted March 24, 2011 [hv=pc=n&n=sa86hkdat983ck863&d=s&v=e&b=3&a=1hp2dp2sp2np3sp4sp5np]133|200[/hv] Partner opens, and you are playing 2/1 Game Force. Are you happy with your bidding so far? What is your call? If you interpret partner's 5N as Grand Slam Force, 6♣ would be your weakest response, and 6♠ would show one of the top 3 honors with something extra. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fluffy Posted March 24, 2011 Report Share Posted March 24, 2011 I interpret grand slam force, as far as I know I have a 6♦ response and that's what I'd bid, if you have other agreements and my answer must be 6♠ I bid that Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Phil Posted March 24, 2011 Report Share Posted March 24, 2011 I'm not particularly happy, since I have a nice hand in support of spades, and 4♠ doesn't do justice. I would prefer 4♦ (which should be a spade flag) or at least 4♣. I really don't know what 5N is, but I doubt partner has the right hand for it whatever he intended it as. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Free Posted March 24, 2011 Report Share Posted March 24, 2011 Agree with Fluf Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TWO4BRIDGE Posted March 24, 2011 Report Share Posted March 24, 2011 [hv=pc=n&n=sa86hkdat983ck863&d=s&v=e&b=3&a=1hp2dp2sp2np3sp4sp5np]133|200[/hv] If you interpret partner's 5N as Grand Slam Force, 6♣ would be your weakest response, and 6♠ would show one of the top 3 honors with something extra.You have ONE of the top 3 AND "something else" -- ♥ K ( as well as the 3 other controls in the minors ). Partner must be void in one of the minors -- I'm not sure which : 5 6 ( 2 0 or 0 2 ) -- other wise he would bid 4NT ( RKC ). If he is ♣ A x or ♦ K x, you are probably cold for 7S.... but how to know ? .....Surely he wouldn't bid 5NT with ♣ Q x ( or worse ), so I'm putting him on ♣ A x and ♦ void. I'd like to bid 7S, but what if he is missing one of the top 3 ♠ honors ? Heck, the grand may still be on a hook ..... sooo, I'll just bid 7S and be done with it ! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mtvesuvius Posted March 24, 2011 Report Share Posted March 24, 2011 6♠, you answered your own question in the OP. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chasetb Posted March 24, 2011 Report Share Posted March 24, 2011 TWO is trying to think outside the box, but I see it there is no box on this hand. You have 6 controls and one of the top three honors, 6♠ wtp Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Trinidad Posted March 24, 2011 Report Share Posted March 24, 2011 I don't get it. How can this possibly be a GSF? I have not shown any controls and partner says that the grand depends on my spade holding only?!? I can buy that aces in the minors are not relevant. After all, partner could well have minor voids. But how can the ♥K be unimportant? It just doesn't exist. Rik Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chasetb Posted March 24, 2011 Report Share Posted March 24, 2011 I don't get it. How can this possibly be a GSF? I have not shown any controls and partner says that the grand depends on my spade holding only?!? I can buy that aces in the minors are not relevant. After all, partner could well have minor voids. But how can the ♥K be unimportant? It just doesn't exist. Rik Partner has shown at least 6♥ and 5♠ as well as extra values. When you chose Spades, you showed shortness in ♥, which implies that with the 5NT bid (s)he has the A♥ as well as the K♠ and/or Q♠, and probably A♣ and a Diamond void. Partner was willing to go to 6 opposite you having NO help in Spades, yet you have both the A♠ and the K♥, which he shouldn't expect you to have, not to mention the K♣ and A♦. This hand clearly exists, and is worth 6♠ since they have agreements over GSF. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
manudude03 Posted March 24, 2011 Report Share Posted March 24, 2011 I must confess to being the 6H bidder. It is partially influenced by my own preferences with the responses to GSF. For me, this logically shows 1 of the top 3 and a ♥ card. Given that partner bid 5NT with no information about our controls, he probably only cares about the majors (AQJxx AQJTxxx void A maybe if that isn't a 2C opener). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mtvesuvius Posted March 24, 2011 Report Share Posted March 24, 2011 Partner clearly has something like ??xxx AQJxxx - Ax, substitute whatever spades you would like for the "?"... Regardless the correct bid is still 6♠. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gnasher Posted March 25, 2011 Report Share Posted March 25, 2011 I expect partner has KQJxx AQJxxxxx - - Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
matmat Posted March 25, 2011 Report Share Posted March 25, 2011 Partner clearly has something like ??xxx AQJxxx - Ax, substitute whatever spades you would like for the "?"... Regardless the correct bid is still 6♠. unless i've somehow shown the ♥K in the auction (did I?) I am not sure how 5n can be gsf with this hand, i could easily be 32 in the majors with two baby hearts... I almost feel like a H?xxx AQJxxx Kx -- is more likely, fishing for a 62 diamond fit. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LH2650 Posted March 25, 2011 Author Report Share Posted March 25, 2011 [hv=pc=n&s=skqj954haqt9753dc]133|100[/hv] At the local club, no one managed to reach a grand slam with these cards, and no progress was made in the post mortem. Any suggestions? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
aguahombre Posted March 25, 2011 Report Share Posted March 25, 2011 [hv=pc=n&s=skqj954haqt9753dc]133|100[/hv] At the local club, no one managed to reach a grand slam with these cards, and no progress was made in the post mortem. Any suggestions? We could get to 7, via 2C-2D-3H (easy to find out about heart king and spade ace immediately). But that would require opener to focus on hearts being trump before the auction starts, and might not be wise without the heart jack. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mtvesuvius Posted March 25, 2011 Report Share Posted March 25, 2011 wd Gnasher :) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TWO4BRIDGE Posted March 25, 2011 Report Share Posted March 25, 2011 We could get to 7, via 2C-2D-3H (easy to find out about heart king and spade ace immediately). But that would require opener to focus on hearts being trump before the auction starts, and might not be wise without the heart jack.I like Aquaman's 2C open suggestion, "initially" setting Hts as trump and demanding cuebids: 2C - 2D3H(jump) - 3S5NT! - 6D ( or 6H ) = one of the top 3 Ht honors7S ( hoping that the Sp cue was NOT a VOID ! ) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ArtK78 Posted March 25, 2011 Report Share Posted March 25, 2011 [hv=pc=n&s=skqj954haqt9753dc]133|100[/hv] At the local club, no one managed to reach a grand slam with these cards, and no progress was made in the post mortem. Any suggestions? I suspected that opener's hand was something like this. In my opinion, 5NT has to be a GSF if the partnership plays GSF. The fact that I hold the ♥K and an outside ace causes me to think that partner's hand may not be an ideal GSF, but that doesn't change the partnership agreement. So I answer the question that he asked. It may or may not get us to the right spot, but I am not in a position to overrule partner. Given that the partnership is playing an unusual form of GSF that allows an answer of "a top honor and something extra," partner's GSF is not a bad choice. Responder should realize that opener must have a 5-8 or 6-7 hand to make this call, and the "something extra" can only be a missing heart honor in addition to a missing spade honor. So, responder has what opener is looking for. But I would not jump to 7. Partner can bid 7 himself. Who knows? Maybe partner was being very creative, and the 6♠ "I have a top honor and something extra" response will not be enough for him to bid the grand. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
whereagles Posted March 25, 2011 Report Share Posted March 25, 2011 If pard bids 5NT over my wimpish 4♠ response, he can't be weary of a minor suit loser, so I guess he has like a 5701 with singleton ace of clubs. If I trust pard, I'll probably bid 7♠. If not, I'll settle for 6♠, as 5NT might already be a silly bid :) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chasetb Posted March 25, 2011 Report Share Posted March 25, 2011 Responder should realize that opener must have a 5-8 or 6-7 hand to make this call, and the "something extra" can only be a missing heart honor in addition to a missing spade honor. So, responder has what opener is looking for. But I would not jump to 7. Partner can bid 7 himself.Partner wouldn't have a 5-8 hand, otherwise his/her 3rd bid should have been a jump to 4♥. Therefore, it's either 5-6 and no worries about the minors or 6-7. I do agree with you, as do most of us sane people here, that the hand is If you want to get there (easily?), play Precision Club and open that hand 1♣. For me, it would go: 1♣-2♣(positive transfer to ♦); 4♦(Majors)-7♠. If not, follow the bidding sequence outlined in the very first post, adding 6♠ and 7♠ to the end. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Trinidad Posted March 25, 2011 Report Share Posted March 25, 2011 I don't get it. How can this possibly be a GSF? I have not shown any controls and partner says that the grand depends on my spade holding only?!? I can buy that aces in the minors are not relevant. After all, partner could well have minor voids. But how can the ♥K be unimportant? It just doesn't exist. Rik Partner has shown at least 6♥ and 5♠ as well as extra values. When you chose Spades, you showed shortness in ♥, which implies that with the 5NT bid (s)he has the A♥ as well as the K♠ and/or Q♠, and probably A♣ and a Diamond void. Partner was willing to go to 6 opposite you having NO help in Spades, yet you have both the A♠ and the K♥, which he shouldn't expect you to have, not to mention the K♣ and A♦. This hand clearly exists, and is worth 6♠ since they have agreements over GSF.Why can't I be 3-2 in the majors?Why can't I be 2-1 in the majors? I mean, it is pretty simple to me: If you have this kind of a hand, with these controls, you want to be in 7♠. But I still don't get what kind of hand partner can have to justify 5NT. The actual hand is an example of a hand that should not bid 5NT. If I don't have the ♠A and ♥K and 6♠ is pretty poor. If I am 2-1 in the majors it is already down on a trump lead. I would open the actual hand with 1♠. After that I will rebid hearts until I get a preference from partner. It might go: 1♠-2♦ 5+♠ - GF 5(4)+♦2♥-2♠ 5-4+ ♠+♥ - 3 or 2 ♠3♥-3♠ 5-5+ ♠+♥ - 3♠4♣-4♦ mixed cue - mixed cue4♥-4♠ mixed cue - Still a balanced minimum5♣-5♥ 1st round control - ♥A or K (obviously partner and I know it is the K because partner has cued hearts before)5NT-... GSF - whatever response shows 17♠ Obviously, there are still a lot of decisions that could go some other way, and that might complicate the auction. Rik Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zelandakh Posted April 3, 2011 Report Share Posted April 3, 2011 Treating Opener's hand as at least an Acol 2, bidding for me is 1C = 15+ bal, or 15+ nat, or 18+ any... - 1S = 9+, no 4 card major, GF1N = relay, usually 18+... - 2C = 5+ diamonds, 0-4 clubs2D = relay... - 2H = 4 clubs2S = relay... - 2N = 5 diamonds3C = relay... - 4H = 3154, extras, 5 controls4S = relay... - 5H = diamond control, club control, spade control, no HA5N = Q ask... - 6C = no CQ6H = HK/Q? (non-forcing)... - 6S = yes, but no SQ7S If Responder does not have the HK we have to play 6H instead of 6S. Usually this sequence with 5NT asks specifically for queens but in the case of a singleton suit the King is also counted since it is otherwise difficult to locate. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
johnu Posted April 12, 2011 Report Share Posted April 12, 2011 What else can 5NT be except a classical GSF? If partner had doubt about which suit to play, they could bid 6♥. Lacking the ♥K,and the ♠A, partner must be gambling that hearts can be set up by a ruff or two (or possibly a finesse) if you only have the ♠A. You have both so 7 must be a good contract. I bid 7♥ in case hearts may play better than spades. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
barryallen Posted April 12, 2011 Report Share Posted April 12, 2011 Am I missing something here? After that sequence I would bid 5♥ and would expect partner holding the ♥K and ♠A to put us straight into the grand. Even if partner was unsure of what was going on, there would be little doubt with a 6♠ bid over a possible 5♠ rebid. But as it was the 5NT bid should be good enough to enable the grand to be bid? Once you take onboard there is no interest in the minor holdings? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
1eyedjack Posted April 12, 2011 Report Share Posted April 12, 2011 If you want to get there (easily?), play Precision Club and open that hand 1♣.If you want the auction to be at the 4 level before you get to make your first descriptive bid, play precision club and open that hand 1C Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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