How to force?

[rduran1216]

♠AKJxxx

♥Ax

♦x

♣AQxx

 

LHO opens 1D partner overcalls 1H and it gets passed to you.

 

So you bid 2D (what else?) LHO passes, then partner bids 3H, now what?

 

 

If you bid 2S originally over 1H, partner will bid 3S, now what?

[mtvesuvius]

So you bid 2D

NO! NO! NO!

 

I bid a forcing 1♠. The auction will be much clearer now that partner does not expect a fit.

[rduran1216]

NO! NO! NO!

 

I bid a forcing 1♠. The auction will be much clearer now that partner does not expect a fit.

 

Slight snag, 1S isn't forcing for your partnership in this problem, and 2S meaning is undiscussed, and ur partner is 85 and has already made a negative dbl with a 6 count 4243 after 1H 2C x...so this problem gets uglier

[jillybean]

What he said.

 

Edit , after reading the above post, 4♠

[Hanoi5]

IF 1♠ was not forcing, then 2♦ and now 3♠ is. So 3♠.

[Bbradley62]

Slight snag, 1S isn't forcing for your partnership in this problem, and 2S meaning is undiscussed, and ur partner is 85 and has already made a negative dbl with a 6 count 4243 after 1H 2C x...so this problem gets uglier

If you're not playing bridge, then just bid 4S and be done with it.

[rduran1216]

IF 1♠ was not forcing, then 2♦ and now 3♠ is. So 3♠.

 

partner bids 4S, continue?

[Hanoi5]

partner bids 4S, continue?

 

Yes. Partner's 3♥ (which should show a better than minimum hand) gives the 1♦ opening certain foul smell, and actually if partner held as little as ♠Qxx♥KQJxxx♦xx♣xx, which he shouldn't, I can make 6♠. I'd bid 4NT and ask for the spade queen over a 0 Aces response (I'd pass 5♠ if partner held no ace and no ♠Q. The opening bid doesn't mean LHO holds ♠QTxx (though maybe it makes it more likely?), but I tend to be an optimist when it comes to slams :D .

[mike777]

partner bids 4S, continue?

 

 

rkc now; 3h says pard has a real hand ...I got a 3.5 to 4 loser adjusted hand...

[mtvesuvius]

I hope I'm getting paid?!

 

I bid 4♠. Why on earth is this in A/E forum anyway?

[rduran1216]

Yes. Partner's 3♥ (which should show a better than minimum hand) gives the 1♦ opening certain foul smell, and actually if partner held as little as ♠Qxx♥KQJxxx♦xx♣xx, which he shouldn't, I can make 6♠. I'd bid 4NT and ask for the spade queen over a 0 Aces response (I'd pass 5♠ if partner held no ace and no ♠Q. The opening bid doesn't mean LHO holds ♠QTxx (though maybe it makes it more likely?), but I tend to be an optimist when it comes to slams :D .

 

Partner has Qxx KQJ10xx Kxxx -

 

I just don't know how to bid this within our agreements, with most partner 1S over 1H is nonforcing constructive, and I certainly wanna force.

[mike777]

Partner has Qxx KQJ10xx Kxxx -

 

I just don't know how to bid this within our agreements, with most partner 1S over 1H is nonforcing constructive, and I certainly wanna force.

 

 

the bidding seems quite standard for those who play 1s as constructive but nf..which is common. what is the problem?

 

(1d)=1h=p=2d

.....3h=3s(new suit forcing)

.....4s=4nt

.....5c(0-3)=5d(q ask)

......5h(kh and Qs)=6s

 

I wont show the club void as I dont know if it is a useful void or not.

[Finch]

If 1S is not forcing (fair enough, although I play it as forcing), then 2S must be forcing, so I do that.

[mike777]

http://bridgeworld.com/default.asp?d=bw_standard&f=bwsall.html#VIC

 

 

 

 

After Our Suit Overcall of a One-Bid

 

After our simple overcall of a one-bid:

 

 

(a) [default]

 

A new-suit bid by an unpassed advancer is natural and nonforcing in all cases.

 

[leaf]

 

natural and forcing.

 

[leaf]

 

always natural, but forcing only after a two-level overcall.

 

(b1) [default]

 

When new-suit advances are forcing, a cue-bid guarantees a fit, a jump cue-bid is a mixed (i.e., semi-preemptive) raise that shows at least one defensive trick, a new-suit bid followed by a same-suit rebid is invitational, and a new-suit jump is a fit-jump.

 

[leaf]

 

weakish.

 

(b2) When new-suit advances are nonforcing, a cue-bid may be either a strong raise or a prelude to a forcing bid in a new suit, a jump cue-bid is a mixed (i.e., semi-preemptive) raise that shows at least one defensive trick, a new-suit bid followed by a same-suit rebid is weakish, and a new-suit jump is invitational.

 

(c1) [default]

 

When a new-suit advance would have been forcing over responder’s pass, if that opponent should bid, the new-suit advance is nonforcing.

 

[leaf]

 

forcing.

 

(d) [default]

 

Over a bid by responder, a jump below-game new-suit advance of an overcall is a fit-jump.

 

[leaf]

 

invitational.

 

[leaf]

 

preemptive.

 

(e) Single raise similar to single raise of major-suitone-bid; direct jump-raises preemptive.

 

 

 

A one-notrump advance of an overcall shows 8-11 points and a stopper in opener’s suit, regardless of vulnerability and suit opened; two notrump is similar, 12-13 points (less after a two-level overcall).

[rhm]

deleted

[gnasher]

If 1S is not forcing (fair enough, although I play it as forcing), then 2S must be forcing, so I do that.

 

"Must" is a strong word (assuming you mean "natural and forcing"). I think it's reasonable to play 1♠ as non-forcing, a cue-bid as promising support, and 2♠ as a fit jump. That makes hands like this hard to bid, but I don't expect to be dealt many of them in my life.

[ewleongusa]

♠AKJxxx

♥Ax

♦x

♣AQxx

 

LHO opens 1D partner overcalls 1H and it gets passed to you.

 

So you bid 2D (what else?) LHO passes, then partner bids 3H, now what?

 

 

If you bid 2S originally over 1H, partner will bid 3S, now what?

 

In Mike Lawrence's book: The Complete Book of Overcalls

 

1S is not forcing.

2S is not forcing and the bid is preemptive.

 

You only route then is to cuebid 2D and then bid spades.

 

Your partner's 3H bid changes everything. My partners would not bid 3H unless their hearts were very good. Certainly, one could expect at least

 

H KQJxxx from partner. I think I would bid 4NT RKC. If partner can show two key cards and the trump queen, I would bid 7H. I don't want to show my spade suit as I don't want to make it easier for the opening leader to lead a club which might give partner problem.

 

Eric Leong

[Siegmund]

If you're worried about accidents, the practical approach is to just raise 3H to 6H. If you have the methods to explore for seven, especially if you suspect the 1D opener of being a joker, fine. I am surprised to see people still trying to introduce the spade suit over 3H - I guess you REALLY dont trust your partner's declarer play!

[matmat]

I suppose if your partner is hard of hearing, which is quite likely as he is 85, you might have to shout "forcing" when placing the 1♠ card on the table.

[TWO4BRIDGE]

 

 

I just don't know how to bid this within our agreements, with most partner 1S over 1H is nonforcing constructive, and I certainly wanna force.

Larry Cohen ( the LoTT guy ) wrote on 5/1/2009 in his website ( http://webcache.googleusercontent.com/search?q=cache:3OUdOEcQbiYJ:www.larryco.com/BridgeArticles/ArticleDetails.aspx%3FarticleID%3D161+Advancer+Bids&cd=1&hl=en&ct=clnk&gl=us ) about Advancer bids .

 

He said the "big issue": "Is a new suit forcing? "

 

He said you could adopt a simple rule.

Then there are two possible ways to play it - choose one:

 

1) New suits by advancer are never forcing. He suggests that a jump by advancer is natural and forcing (he needs some way to show a good hand).

 

OR

 

2) New suits by advancer are forcing (unless advancer is already a Passed Hand).

 

If you have agreed to #1, then Advancer here will bid 2S-jump ( and it is not a fit-jump ).

 

Overcaller raises to 3S ( as you said ).

 

Advancer with his 4 loser hand is certainly worth a Ctrl cuebid OR with no 2 quick losers in the side-suits he could just go 4NT-RKC.

 

The 4C! Ctrl cue will get you 4S by Overcaller-- sensing wastage opposite his void.

[rduran1216]

I suppose if your partner is hard of hearing, which is quite likely as he is 85, you might have to shout "forcing" when placing the 1♠ card on the table.

 

Fantastic post hahahaha.

[mike777]

I suppose if your partner is hard of hearing, which is quite likely as he is 85, you might have to shout "forcing" when placing the 1♠ card on the table.

 

 

I think this is very unfair.......it is common to play 1s as nf even in bws.

 

 

 

Granted on this deal and most others pard will rebid.

[pooltuna]

Slight snag, 1S isn't forcing for your partnership in this problem, and 2S meaning is undiscussed, and ur partner is 85 and has already made a negative dbl with a 6 count 4243 after 1H 2C x...so this problem gets uglier

 

 

okay since I can't abstain (BWS is like a bible) you are forced to call 2♦ and If that is your only forcing call you cannot play that as necessarily promising a fit.

[mtvesuvius]

I think this is very unfair.......it is common to play 1s as nf even in bws.

 

 

 

Granted on this deal and most others pard will rebid.

Apparently you have NO sense of humour.

[dake50]

What's my "I take control" bid after 1H overcall?

Hope some lower than 4N.

My partnership uses 2NT(as Ogust):

H-bad/H-good bal/H-good and short lo/mid/hi. Step for controls.