Two questions

[l milne]

The last thread I posted in A/E was pretty much unanimous, so here's my new one.

 

1. What is this double?

1♥-X-P-2♠;

3♥-P-P-X!

 

2. [hv=pc=n&s=sj84hk7dak84caq96&d=e&v=b&b=10&a=1hdp1s2h]133|200[/hv]

[mtvesuvius]

1. Maximal

2. Double again

[l milne]

What are a few example hands for auction 1?

[Quantumcat]

In Auction 2, doubling again after having made a takeout double and partner has already responded usually shows a very good hand and three-card support for partner. It invites them to pass the double if they want to, or else take it out to a better suit, and to bid game if they aren't totally crap. So yeah, South has another double.

 

In Auction 1, the double means you have a maximum and you don't want to defend 3♥ undoubled, and giving the doubler a second chance to bid 4♠. If the doubler is minimum (10 to a bad 12, say) they could take it out to 3♠, or if they have a good hand (say 15+ and defensive) with three spades (and opps vul) they might pass. If they kind of wanted to bid 4♠ the first time but for some reason didn't, they would bid it now.

 

Also if as doubler you have four spades and think you might have a tough choice if partner doubles, just bid 3♠ after 3♥ yourself before they get a chance. A second double by you (right after 3♥) will show a very good hand with three spades and invite a pass from partner.

 

Some hands:

 

♠AQJ5

♥8743

♦KJ95

♣4

 

♠QJ975

♥7

♦Q2

♣KJ952

 

♠AJT3

♥765

♦KQ9

♣Q32

 

Presuming that you'd bid 2♠ with any decent 8-count with 5 spades, you would double with:

Any 12 count (you almost bid game yourself anyway)

A good 10-11 count

A very good 9-count

An exceptional 8-count (note: don't do it on a very shapely 8 count with little defense when the opponents are vulnerable. In those circumstances you shouldn't be surprised by a pass from partner, when they make 3♥ and us 4♠. It is ok if the opps are not vul, then partner's only real choices are 3♠ or 4♠.)

 

You wouldn't double with six spades because if partner passes you will get less defensive spade tricks than your partner could reasonably expect. You should have bid 3♠ or 4♠ the first time.

[jukmoi]

1. Competitive double. About 10-11 hcp with usually 4c♠.

2. I much prefer 1NT in first round. Maybe second double should be penalty oriented eg hand that is too strong to bid 1NT in first round and usually no ♠ support?

[awm]

I'd take the first double as a lot more penalty-oriented than others seem to think.

 

The 2♠ bidder has already limited his hand (making a NF 2♠ bid). I don't think "maximal doubles" are on in such a situation. On the other hand, the 3♥ bidder could easily be walking into a trap, considering that his opponents have most of the values and hearts are quite likely breaking badly (i.e. doubler being short, 2♠ bidder being long). I think it's pretty important to have a penalty double available in this auction, especially at MP scoring.

 

Agree with double on the second hand (showing extras but no clear fit) which seems straightforward. I don't make initial takeout doubles on hands where I want to penalize the suit opened at a low level.

[Fluffy]

Even if 2♠ is allowed to have 5 spades, the double should always be only 4 spade cards, bid 3♠ with 5

[gwnn]

"maximum balanced", doubler should always pass with 3 spades or 4 spades and a defensive hand.

[pooltuna]

The last thread I posted in A/E was pretty much unanimous, so here's my new one.

 

1. What is this double?

1♥-X-P-2♠;

3♥-P-P-X!

 

2. [hv=pc=n&s=sj84hk7dak84caq96&d=e&v=b&b=10&a=1hdp1s2h]133|200[/hv]

 

1. The opponents have erred!

2. for me 2♠ shows this hand EDIT: but not as well as a Direct 1NT/1♥

[nigel_k]

1. I think it just shows a maximum 2♠ bid based on high cards not shape. It's not for penalty but the doubler will pass more often than not probably since they would have acted over 3♥ with most offensive hands.

 

2. To me this is a bare minimum for a second double and pass would not be badly wrong. People who are making takeout doubles on 12 HCP 4333 shapes obviously need to double more freely the second time because partner will be reluctant to act in the passout seat.

[Fluffy]

2. for me 2♠ shows this hand EDIT: but not as well as a Direct 1NT/1♥

Bidding 1NT with doubleton honnor over 1 major is a very bad mistake, you hardly stop their suit from running and you have a perfect hand for double.

 

I think you aren't very serious about the 2♠ bid, are you?

[pooltuna]

Bidding 1NT with doubleton honnor over 1 major is a very bad mistake, you hardly stop their suit from running and you have a perfect hand for double.

 

I think you aren't very serious about the 2♠ bid, are you?

 

As for 1NT/1♥ I had not seen your simulation showing that it loses 5 or 10 IMPS everytime you try it. As for 2♠ that is how my responses are structured. I don't bid 2♠ with a minimum opener over partner's 1♠ call just because I hold 4. It feels too much like I am just rebidding the same values twice. Consequently when I bid 3♠ over partner's 1♠ call it means we are odds on to make game if he has a normal uncontested(i.e. minimal) 1♠ call and if I make a 4♠ call it means I have the equivalent of a 2♣ opener.

[han]

I haven't done this in a while:

 

LOL

[ewleongusa]

The last thread I posted in A/E was pretty much unanimous, so here's my new one.

 

1. What is this double?

1♥-X-P-2♠;

3♥-P-P-X!

 

2. [hv=pc=n&s=sj84hk7dak84caq96&d=e&v=b&b=10&a=1hdp1s2h]133|200[/hv]

 

One the first hand, partner is showing a maximum hand that wants to bid on but he doesn't know what to do.

For example, give partner something like S AQxx H Jxx D Axx C xxx or the equivalent.

 

On the second hand, double would show this type of hand where you have the hcp to want to bid 2S but you only have three card spade support.

 

Eric Leong