lesh Posted November 3, 2010 Report Share Posted November 3, 2010 You hold as West AKxx KQJx xx AKx All vul, North deals, North Partner South youp p 3di DBLp 4sp p ? What do you bid and what does it mean. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bucky Posted November 3, 2010 Report Share Posted November 3, 2010 The lack of diamond raise worries me a little. With partner passing initially, I don't think pass here is clearly wrong. If I do decide to invite, the choice is 5♠, asking for a diamond control. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lesh Posted November 4, 2010 Author Report Share Posted November 4, 2010 What would be 5cl then? to play? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
655321 Posted November 4, 2010 Report Share Posted November 4, 2010 5♠, asking for diamond control. I wouldn't pass, partner has to have 5 spades and an Ace, plus some more. What would be 5cl then? to play? 5♣ would be natural, showing a strong flexible hand with long clubs. It isn't a cue bid agreeing spades. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cascade Posted November 4, 2010 Report Share Posted November 4, 2010 I am closer to blasting 6♠ and hoping for diamond control than passing. Especially if partner is allowed to exercise some judgement over 5♠ and not bid slam with a minimum with a diamond control. Otherwise 5♠ is fairly normal. A new suit (5♣ or 5♥) is natural and stronger than an overcall or jump overcall. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Phil Posted November 4, 2010 Report Share Posted November 4, 2010 If I'm not bidding 5♠ with a hand like this, what hand would I bid it on? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mikeh Posted November 4, 2010 Report Share Posted November 4, 2010 classic 5♠ hand. The lack of a diamond raise by LHO is irrelevant...at this vulnerability, he won't be raising even with 3 card support when he has a lot of losers on the side, and we know he has a lot of losers on the side. Main risk is that partner's control is Kxx and the defence is diamond A and a ruff. Partner can bring us back in with 5N with that hand, but we don't have the ability to count 12 winners in 6N..... QJxxx Ax Kxx xxx is a 4♠ bid, and we have no hope of 12 tricks in notrump. Give him the club Q and he has an opening hand. But bridge is no game for pessimists, so 5♠ it is....and I bid only 6♠ over 6♦....no interest in grand, thx. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Phil Posted November 4, 2010 Report Share Posted November 4, 2010 ...and I bid only 6♠ over 6♦....no interest in grand, thx. Not even a little 'last train' love with 6♥? :( Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fluffy Posted November 4, 2010 Report Share Posted November 4, 2010 I think 5NT is the bid that shows first round control of diamonds. IMO we are closer to pass than what people say, but it is still a 5♠ bid Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
benlessard Posted November 4, 2010 Report Share Posted November 4, 2010 wtp 5S, really obvious Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bucky Posted November 4, 2010 Report Share Posted November 4, 2010 What would be 5cl then? to play?5♣ shows a flexible hand (and forward-going), 3415 or 3316 shapes are ideal. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mtvesuvius Posted November 4, 2010 Report Share Posted November 4, 2010 If I'm not bidding 5♠ with a hand like this, what hand would I bid it on?Yeah, what Phil said :) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bucky Posted November 4, 2010 Report Share Posted November 4, 2010 I think it also sort of depends on opps level. If partner is marked with a couple of diamonds, what is the chance of slam facing an initially passed partner? Most of the time 5-level should be safe, but not always, for example facing: Qxxx, Ax, xx, QJxxx. If I can count on partner having 5th spade, I will bid more aggressively. But there is no way for me to tell. I can certainly live with 5♠, in fact I might bid it at the table, but it is far from clear-cut. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bucky Posted November 4, 2010 Report Share Posted November 4, 2010 classic 5♠ hand. The lack of a diamond raise by LHO is irrelevant...at this vulnerability, he won't be raising even with 3 card support when he has a lot of losers on the side, and we know he has a lot of losers on the side.At unfavorable vulnerability I'd certainly be more cautious, but with equal vul I see nothing wrong with raising to 4♦ on 3-card support (or sometimes 4-card support when diamonds splits 4-6). At least it deprives opponents some room for cuebidding, and opponents are not really apt to double 4♦ with fit in major(s) (nor would a double necessarily be the winning action)... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mikeh Posted November 5, 2010 Report Share Posted November 5, 2010 I think 5NT is the bid that shows first round control of diamonds. IMO we are closer to pass than what people say, but it is still a 5♠ bidso we bid 6♦ with Kx and expect partner to bid 6N? I suspect you'll see the problem with that approach if you consider who's on opening lead :rolleyes: And I trust you aren't suggesting that over 6♦, you'll bid 6N after either 6♥ or 6♠? I would give you long odds that the consensus amongst experts, told that partner bid 6♦ over 5♠ would be that this was first round control. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Free Posted November 5, 2010 Report Share Posted November 5, 2010 5♠ asks for a ♦ control, so that's what I'll do. 5♣ would be natural, so that's out of the question. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
the hog Posted November 5, 2010 Report Share Posted November 5, 2010 5D asking for a D control for me! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mikeh Posted November 5, 2010 Report Share Posted November 5, 2010 5D asking for a D control for me!and 5♠ by you would show one? lol....you are in a universe of one on this answer 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rduran1216 Posted November 5, 2010 Report Share Posted November 5, 2010 seriously, is suspect this hand is in the bridge encyclopedia under 5S for this type of auction. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dake50 Posted November 5, 2010 Report Share Posted November 5, 2010 As I respond to 3-level T/O Dbl, partner seeing game -- he did jump 4S -- always cues 1st control, 2nd if 4+controls (controls rich). He did not. I quit. Edit: Of course not any Q-bid. A DIAMOND Q-BID. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zelandakh Posted November 5, 2010 Report Share Posted November 5, 2010 and 5♠ by you would show one? lol....you are in a universe of one on this answerDenial cue bids are perfectly sound and actually make many auctions simpler. For example, you never need Last Train and bidding 5M tends to carry only a natural meaning. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mikeh Posted November 5, 2010 Report Share Posted November 5, 2010 Denial cue bids are perfectly sound and actually make many auctions simpler. For example, you never need Last Train and bidding 5M tends to carry only a natural meaning.I have played denial cuebidding, and don't understand your point. hog said that over 5♠, a 5N response would promise 1st round diamond control and I lol'd that...and still do. Since 5♠ commits to slam opposite a diamond control it should permit 6N when the hands are Kx opposite xx, with 12 winners on the side (imagine AKxx KQJ10x xx AK...opposite Q10xxx Ax Kxx Qxx....the only making slam is 6N by partner....how do you bid it, while allowing for 6♠ when the advancer has Q10xxx Axx Kx Qxx? A hint: you want notrump to be bid by the 2nd round control of diamonds, not xx. Now, maybe I misunderstood his post...or you did? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mtvesuvius Posted November 6, 2010 Report Share Posted November 6, 2010 As I respond to 3-level T/O Dbl, partner seeing game -- he did jump 4S -- always cues 1st control, 2nd if 4+controls (controls rich). He did not. I quit.Excuse me? Partner is supposed to cuebid a natural call? Fun. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cyberyeti Posted November 6, 2010 Report Share Posted November 6, 2010 seriously, is suspect this hand is in the bridge encyclopedia under 5S for this type of auction.Interesting point, we would use 5♠ as "I'm happy about the side suits, how good are your trumps?". Is 4N blackwood here ? what do you do with a 1444 21 count if it is ? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fluffy Posted November 6, 2010 Report Share Posted November 6, 2010 Interesting point, we would use 5♠ as "I'm happy about the side suits, how good are your trumps?". Is 4N blackwood here ? what do you do with a 1444 21 count if it is ?4N is blackwood. When your hand suggests to play 3NT you bid 3NT not double. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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