1H, weak 2H, or Pass

[carena_sez]

[hv=d=s&v=n&s=s942hajt842dca864]133|100|Scoring: MP[/hv]

 

Please explain your choice of bid.

[quiddity]

I think it's clear to bid with this shape and suit, and I would choose 1♥ for several reasons:

 

1. Defensive quick tricks (2 aces).

2. Better than expected playing strength (6-4, void).

3. Decent support for the other major. We could miss a 4♠ contract by opening 2♥.

[jdonn]

I think it's clear to bid with this shape and suit, and I would choose 1♥ for several reasons:

 

1. Defensive quick tricks (2 aces).

2. Better than expected playing strength (6-4, void).

3. Decent support for the other major. We could miss a 4♠ contract by opening 2♥.

I agree but would expand upon 3. We have a great hand for playing in any suit but diamonds, due not only to the shape but also to the aces.

[jonottawa]

At these colors, I bid 2♥. Pard knows I have more than zip and pip here. If I were NV I would open 1♥.

[bucky]

I would not consider PASS or 2♥. I think OP ought to offer the choice of 3♥ in the poll. In any case I think 1♥ is a standout.

[Siegmund]

I pass, but have no serious objection to anyone who thinks it's good enough to open 1H. I do have quite a few objections to 2H :)

[the hog]

2H for me playing 2/1. 1H is asking for trouble.

[655321]

1♥ looks normal to me, don't like pass or 2♥.

[P_Marlowe]

Hi,

 

I voted 2H, but I dont mind pass.

 

In the end this is something to discuss with partner.

You have 2 Aces and a void, so you have lots of defence, more than

p will expect, but than you are red vs. green, and at those colors p

may already expect a sub min. opening hand for 2H.

 

I wont open 1H, basically I req. 10HCP for an opening bid, and that is

nothing to discuss, that is a hard req., somewhere you need to draw

the line, that you will never cross.

 

With kind regards

Marlowe

[1eyedjack]

I voted for Pass. I keep hearing the maxim trotted out that there is no such hand as one that falls between a 1H and 2H opener, but I have never seen a convincing argument.

[carena_sez]

Thanks for thoughts everyone.

 

The debate about whether it's too good for 2♥, but not good enough for 1♥ is an interesting one.

 

The K & R Evaluator says that (9xx AJT8xx A8xx ---) = 13.70 points on their evaluation scale.

 

http://www.jeff-goldsmith.org/cgi-bin/knr....9xx+AJt8xx+A8xx

 

 

 

Change the shape tho and the same cards, but different distribution and

 

K&R (9xx AJT8xx A8 xx) = 11.90

 

K&R (9xx AJT8xx A 8xx) = 11.50

 

So maybe it's the Aces and the powerful shape that make it worth 1♥ opener rather than pass or 2♥?

 

 

I must say I didn't consider including 3♥ in the poll, but perhaps I should have.

 

I suspect some will have same distaste for pre-empting with 2 Aces?

[1eyedjack]

I don't think that it is necessarily all about being "too good" for 2H and "not good enough" for 1H. There are other factors in play, such as having too much defense for 2H and not enough offense for 1H. Or too much in the other major for a hand that is otherwise about right in strength for weak 2.

 

Sure this hand has a lot of offense when a fit is found. Trouble is that partner will drive the level up opposite a 1 opener just on points when there is no decent fit. At least that is what my partners do.

 

If passing first and then coming in is used to show this sort of hand, then job done. The obvious drawback in passing first is that opponents may not leave you with a convenient opportunity to show the hand next time at a safe level.

[hanp]

I think no experienced bridge player would ever open a weak 2 with this.

[jillybean]

1♥, my partner expects aggressive openings but I'd open it with a p/u partner too.

[jillybean]

1♥, my partner expects aggressive openings but I'd open it with a p/u partner too.

Correction. I was wrong, my partner opens 2♥

[Phil]

I think no experienced bridge player would ever open a weak 2 with this.

No is an overbid.

 

I would open 1♥ here and 1♥ on the other thread where the hand is very close.

 

I'm prepared to apologize if we get to a lousy 3N.

[CSGibson]

I pass with this, 2nd choice 1♥. I don't think its right to bid a weak 2 on a hand that has slam potential in two other suits, and I don't think that an initial opening bid is a good description of this hand, either. I will lie in the weeds on this one, and hope that the bidding will leave me better placed on the next round.

[whereagles]

There is no hand that is too strong for 2, too weak for 1.

 

This one I'd open 1♥, mostly because I hate opening weak 2s on two aces.

[pooltuna]

I pass with this, 2nd choice 1♥. I don't think its right to bid a weak 2 on a hand that has slam potential in two other suits, and I don't think that an initial opening bid is a good description of this hand, either. I will lie in the weeds on this one, and hope that the bidding will leave me better placed on the next round.

WHAT!!! A voice of reason in the darkness? QUICK! RUN!! Before the BBF average poster lynch mob catches you :)

[jillybean]

I understand pass and 1♥, I don't understand 2♥ at all. Would the 2♥ bidders care to explain their choice?

[Flameous]

I don't have opening hand (in any limited opening system I do), I have a six card suit even with some texture, I pre-empt. I'm slightly influenced by that 2S from partner is semiforcing, so he bids more often -> we get to 4S when it's right.

 

I'm don't think it's huge problem having two aces for a pre-empt. Maybe we miss a chance to double their partial or something which we could do after 1♥ but I don't see it happening too often. (Now if they were two side suit aces, I'd totally agree)

 

For me each hand tends to be either opening or pre-empt, no passing in between ;)

[NickRW]

Personally, I don't undersand 2♥. At the colours it is maybe not too strong - but never the less it is on the strong side for a preempt. It also has some defensive capability and will play in two other suits.

 

Playing any system or style where light opening bids are part of the scene, it is imo, a wtp 1♥. I've never played 2/1 or any system that really demands sound openings - but I can understand a 2/1er passing it.

 

Nick

[Flame]

I've voted for 1H, but 2H at this vul is not so bad, the 2 aces and the overall strengh doesnt bother me much, the 3 spades is probebly the only real resson I'd go for the 1H rather then 2H.

[the hog]

I understand pass and 1♥, I don't understand 2♥ at all. Would the 2♥ bidders care to explain their choice?

As someone who has no qualms opening this hand 2H, sure.

Firstly unless you are playing an lob system, opening 1H is foolish. Look at Phil's comment that he would apologise if his partnership reached a poor 3NT. Surely this is misguided; you have a nice hand, why spoil it by stating that you have high card values you don't posses?

 

I understand pass. Pass is fine IF this hand does not fall within the ambit of what YOU AND YOUR PARTNER have defined as a 2H bid. Look at the vulnerability. There is no rule that says you cannot be top of the range for a 2H opening.

 

Some posters comment on the fact that having 3S is a disadvantage. I disagree that this is a problem; with a strong hand partner can still investigate a S contract.

[Zelandakh]

This thread is actually very interesting. We have strong votes for all 3 of the main choices. We also have strong opinions against all of those 3 choices with some degree of preference between the other 2. For me it is most of all not a pass. My choice is for 1H but I would bid 2H if this did not fall in the parameters of a 1H opener with a given partner. If it did not qualify for either then I would suggest changing the system...