Agree or disagree?

[rduran1216]

[hv=d=e&v=n&n=skxxhakxxdxc109xxx&e=saq10xxxhqj7dxxcax]266|200|Scoring: MP[/hv]

 

Auction:

 

1S 2D x p

p! p

 

 

Is pass unspeakable at these colors?

 

 

lead is J of spades, plan the defense.

[aguahombre]

Pass is not unspeakable. There are people who don't play negative doubles. From the looks of dummy, your partner might be one of them. I think that 2S would be the normal rebid if neg doubles are being used.

[rduran1216]

Pass is not unspeakable. There are people who don't play negative doubles. From the looks of dummy, your partner might be one of them. I think that 2S would be the normal rebid if neg doubles are being used.

we are playing negative doubles, South is an unknown player at a club game

[aguahombre]

In that case you already know that passing the neg double is wrong unless you have information not based on the auction.

[jjbrr]

lol?

[matmat]

lol?

correct.

[kfay]

Agree

[rduran1216]

Agree

assuming you pass, whats the plan for 6 tricks?

[peachy]

If the Dbl was a negative double (which I assume it was, unless something unusual was agreed), pass makes zero sense.

[matmat]

Agree

assuming you pass, whats the plan for 6 tricks?

I doubt kfay is passing.

[jukmoi]

Well - matchpoints and opponents vulnerable are the only conditions in wich passing make slightest sense.

 

Anyway I overtake ♠J with Q and return ♣A.

[rduran1216]

my logic at the table was

 

1) partner doesn't have 3 spades

2) partner doesn't have 5 hearts

3) partner has K of clubs, shortness in spades, and with a heart card, South is going down 2 red.

 

Some of these were table feel, some were implied. The interesting question is how to find 6+ tricks if they're there.

[rogerclee]

Pass was unbelievably retarded, now I guess I would win with the queen and play club club if partner encourages, and go back to spades if partner discourages.

[rogerclee]

my logic at the table was

 

1) partner doesn't have 3 spades

2) partner doesn't have 5 hearts

3) partner has K of clubs, shortness in spades, and with a heart card, South is going down 2 red.

 

Some of these were table feel, some were implied. The interesting question is how to find 6+ tricks if they're there.

lol?

 

1) Why? It is normal to start with double with an invitational hand with 3-4 in the majors (but agree it's not that likely partner has 3 spades).

2) Why?! It's normal to start with double with a hand with 5+ hearts that is strong enough to make a negative double but too weak to bid 2H.

 

Two general points

 

1) You cannot shoot for a top on every hand, I would say that passing with a hand like this is about as far as shooting gets. I would say it is about a big a position to take as overcalling 6D on void Axx AQxx AKQxxx, maybe bigger.

2) So the table feel told you that partner had a bunch of stuff. Whose table actions told you this, your opponents?! Since I fail to see how an opponent's table action can tell you partner has only 4 hearts and values but a fast double by partner would indicate that he does indeed have only 4 hearts and values, I am guessing this table feel was from reading your partner's tempo, which is of course a big no no.

[Codo]

You opened this thread, so I am sure you did not cheat.

 

Actually, I thought you had been North and wondered how East passed without cheating.

 

Anyway, Roger pointed out how wrong passing was despite the fact that it may be very successful. IF partner has a "pure" take out double of 2 Diamond, he has something aorund 2425 hand. Why should 2 Diamond in their 10 card fit be your best shot for a good score?

 

My partner would double with around 8 HCPS. This makes a total of 19. How do I think that 2 diamond will fail?

Yes partner could well be short in spades. Yes the king of spades can be well placed. But this is a real wild gambling.

[ONEferBRID]

At the risk of "piling on", was East Howard Piltch ?

[gwnn]

pass is almost WTP

 

it's WTPh

[pooltuna]

IME there are no wrong bids in bridge. There are however some calls which are highly anti %age and pass in this case is one of those. Since I'm not passing there is no need to plan a defense yet.

[neilkaz]

Pass was unbelievably retarded, now I guess I would win with the queen and play club club if partner encourages, and go back to spades if partner discourages.

We agree.

[rduran1216]

West's hand is

 

Jx

109xx

10xxx

KQJ

 

 

Partner's style is aggressive, and he would certainly bid 2H with an 8 count and 5 hearts, at least that was my impression at the time.

 

There was no partner tempo issue, it was a poker-like feeling at the table. North who is predictable took some time to pass, and with much of the points occupied already, it smelled like a misfit around the table.

 

duck spade, win the seceond, play A club club, rough partner's 3rd and lay down the A of spades.

 

+200 was good for a top. There are times when you can feel something is right at the table. Pass is not the percentage play over time, and against different opponents with a different partner at a different time, I wouldn't think about passing. Seemed right in this situation and was.

[bid_em_up]

Was there a point to this thread?

 

Passing is horrendous. There is no other way of putting it.

[kayin801]

I would like to have opponents who pass like that every time because I'm fairly sure I would score a 90% on those hands.

[rduran1216]

Was there a point to this thread?

 

Passing is horrendous. There is no other way of putting it.

How?

 

give partner

 

x

Axxx

Jxx

Kxxxx

 

or

 

Kx

Kxxx

Qxx

Qxxx

 

or

 

x

10xxxx

Kxx

KQxx

 

or

 

Jx

AKxx

xxx

Kxxx

 

or

 

ok here's a bad hand partner could make a dbl with

 

xx

Kxxxx

Jxx

QJx

 

 

 

at these colors putting up 500 or 200 will probably be good, and with the spade lead coming I'm gonna have options to find the right defense.

[jdonn]

Yeah give partner x xxxx AQJT8 xxx and you will be glad you passed a takeout double with xx of the suit!

[aguahombre]

Was there a point to this thread?

Yes. To ask a question, get a pretty much unanimous answer, and then to disagree with the answer.

 

Bonus: to show how doing something against the odds worked at the table and to warn future partners not to make negative doubles when they can overstate their values with a freebid or just raise the major with a doubleton.