"15"-17 NT?

[MarkDean]

I am watching the finals of the USBF trials.

 

I know that the trend is for players to upgrade more and more 14s, but Weinstein just opened 1NT 1st seat white/red on:

 

QJ4

AKQ

T4

QT843

 

To me that does not look like a good 14. Does Weinstein have a different view, or do they pretty much open 14-17 white/red 1st?

[pooltuna]

I am watching the finals of the USBF trials.

 

I know that the trend is for players to upgrade more and more 14s, but Weinstein just opened 1NT 1st seat white/red on:

 

QJ4

AKQ

T4

QT843

 

To me that does not look like a good 14. Does Weinstein have a different view, or do they pretty much open 14-17 white/red 1st?

It looks like an average 14 to me but WTF do I know. I'm not playing in the USBF tournament and they are, plus they usually do pretty well.

[cherdanno]

Looks like an above average 14 count to me.

[Phil]

Why is this hand 'above average'. We have an average number of 10's and no 9's. The five card suit is nice, but it is more than offset by the overstuffed AKQ tripleton so I think its pretty close to average.

 

I would open 1N with a 6th club, or if you move the ♥A or K to the club suit.

 

When I upgrade a 14, I think it needs to be better than hands in the 50th percentile +

[aguahombre]

12.7 on that Kaplan thing.

[helene_t]

Yeah 12.7 doesn't surprise, this hand is a pile of dung.

 

If you open this hand 1NT you certainly ain't playing 15-17.

[MFA]

If this is in your 1NT range you open 1NT. Simple.

Generally lowering the limit a little for opening 1NT has a lot of merit. If one likes to open balanced 11 counts with any excuse, the 1NT rebid will have a broad interval unless we include a lot of the best 14s in the strong NT. Not really a matter of upgrading, just playing 14½-17 NTs. Or 14.3-17 NTs. Or whatever.

[peachy]

The question is ' should be: is this a good 14?

Their convention card is available at the USBF website for this event and the card says the range is 14+ to 17.

 

But I agree about the upgrades, in general, everyone seems to be doing it.

[MarkDean]

Ah, I had not realized they disclose 14+ to 17, think it is closer to the mark then (but I would still open 1♣).

[neilkaz]

The question is ' should be: is this a good 14?

Their convention card is available at the USBF website for this event and the card says the range is 14+ to 17.

 

But I agree about the upgrades, in general, everyone seems to be doing it.

Some players will upgrade almost every hand containing any 5 card suit unless that suit is weak.

 

Here, the suit isn't so good and neither is the hand so this looks at best to be an average 14 to me.

 

But in favor of 1NT is that it is lots harder for the opps to enter the auction then over 1♣. Inspite of that I'd open 1♣ but I certainly am not the level of player that they are.

[NickRW]

Well, just as quite a few standard and 2/1 players play 15-17 with quite a few upgrades, I sometimes play a range that is just a tad weaker - 14-16 with quite a few downgrades. My opinion, for what it is worth, is that this hand is pretty much at the bottom of the range for a 1NT opening of that type - so I find it surprising that someone thinks it was worth a (14)15-17 NT.

 

But - meh - matches are long. And I'd hardly want to play in clubs particularly with it.

 

Nick

[dkharty]

I am watching the finals of the USBF trials. 

 

I know that the trend is for players to upgrade more and more 14s, but Weinstein just opened 1NT 1st seat white/red on:

 

QJ4

AKQ

T4

QT843

 

To me that does not look like a good 14.  Does Weinstein have a different view, or do they pretty much open 14-17 white/red 1st?

14 HCP + 2 HCP for Weinstein's declarer play = 16 HCP

 

Looks like a middle-of-the-road action to me.

 

Now, if he had opened 1C and rebid 2NT, that might have been stretching it...

[Trinidad]

I am watching the finals of the USBF trials.

 

I know that the trend is for players to upgrade more and more 14s, but Weinstein just opened 1NT 1st seat white/red on:

 

QJ4

AKQ

T4

QT843

 

To me that does not look like a good 14. Does Weinstein have a different view, or do they pretty much open 14-17 white/red 1st?

Weinstein's hand is quite a bit better than:

 

QJ4

AKQ

J43

QT84

 

No one will say that this is a good 15 HCP hand, but very few will open it 1♣ when playing a 14+-17 1NT opening.

 

Rik

[655321]

At white/red you (should be) opening a lot more hands than you would at red/white. Therefore, it makes sense to include a few more hands in the lower range of 1NT at w/r too, so that the effect of the wider range is spread, rather than concentrated in the bottom range of hands.

 

Anyway, I would probably open this a (14+)15-17 1NT even when vulnerable, and sorry, it doesn't look like a 12.7HCP hand to me.

[aguahombre]

After watching the trials, with all the "upgrades" of various relatively balanced hands to the next level (once even skipping a level from 19 to 22), I conclude that these players never downgrade.

 

I also conclude that their partners never allow for the liberal upgrades and often the final contract is dependent on sloppy defense to have a chance.

 

Of course, there is a good reason why I was watching the trials, not participating :lol: .

[the hog]

It is an average 14 count. If you open this 1NT then you play a 14-17 NT.

[hanp]

We have an average number of 10's.

No wonder you win so much at rubber bridge.

[billw55]

14 HCP + 2 HCP for Weinstein's declarer play = 16 HCP

Yep ♦Axx in dummy, Weinstein leads low toward his hand and the ten turns into the queen! Bridge magic :)

[mikegill]

I think opening 1N has a lot going for it, although I think it's hard to argue that the hand is "worth" it. It's white/red, you could easily steal a partscore or game from them, not to mention that opening 1N with 3-3 majors is good because you'll always get to a 5-3 fit and play the right partscore.

[Phil]

We have an average number of 10's.

No wonder you win so much at rubber bridge.

Eh didn't notice that ♦10.

 

Obviously it make all the difference.