pick your poison

[mikeh]

[hv=d=s&v=b&s=sak6hj87dakqcj642]133|100|Scoring: MP

You deal and, in deference to Milton Work, open 1♣. LHP bids 1♥ and partner's negative double comes back to you. What do you bid?[/hv]

[CSGibson]

I'm a 2♥ bidder.

[gwnn]

2N, value bid, together we rate to stop hearts somehow, if I bid 2H I don't see how we will have a more intelligent auction but maybe this is just my pessimism.

[helene_t]

agree with Csaba

[gnasher]

2♥. If it was an 18-count before, it still is one, and 2♥ is the way we bid a balanced 18-count without a heart stop.

 

If we do have a heart stop between us, it's not clear who should play it. With this layout:

             A10

 K109xxx        Qx

             Jxx

partner should play it, but with this

             AQx

 K109xx        xx

             Jxx

I should play it.

 

I prefer 2♥ because we may manage to get to 4♠ or 5♣ when there's no heart stop between the two hands, but partner happens to have enough extra to enable us to make. Something like QJxx xx Jxxx AKx would be nice.

[Phil]

Disagree with not opening this 1N.

 

2♥ now.

[wank]

with Jxx i'd prefer to get the NTs in first - i think it's much more likely we should be declaring it than p, but the chance of there being a better spot in a minor and the lesser, but significant, chance that it's ok from partner's hand anyway makes me go for 2H.

 

and i believe in downgrading as well as upgrading.

[Jlall]

Very strong preference for 2N, I'm fine calling Jxx a stopper. Even if they can run the suit they often will fail to (LHO not leading from AQ at MP).

 

I think there are far far far more layouts where we need to declare when we have a stopper. Kxx in dummy with AQ on our left, and Axx in dummy with KQ on our left being the most obvious. Yes opposite either of those if RHO has Hx it plays better from partner's side, but given their vulnerable overcall I think that is way less likely.

 

Even when partner has Ax LHO might choose to underlead the heart, or not lead the heart at all.

 

Meanwhile I think our prospects in any contract other than NT when we have no stopper are quite bleak. Our hand is just garbage for anything else.

[jdonn]

2NT seems best to me, Jxx is nearly a stopper and the auction will be far simpler than after 2♥ where frankly I don't think most people (myself included) have a fantastic idea what they are doing for the rest of the auction.

 

I wouldn't do it at the table because I don't want to be wrong in that direction, but I'm fairly confident downgrading to begin with is right on this hand in the long run btw.

[aguahombre]

I wouldn't do it at the table because I don't want to be wrong in that direction, but I'm fairly confident downgrading to begin with is right on this hand in the long run btw.

Mikeh, in the OP alludes to this. Phil outright would open 1NT. And you, deep down, know it is right to open it 1NT.

 

Maybe, It's a 1NT opener. I know nobody downgrades at your level, but you could lie about seeing one of the Jacks, in the postmortem. Me, I have no reputation to worry about, so it is easy to open 1NT.

[suokko]

I wouldn't do it at the table because I don't want to be wrong in that direction, but I'm fairly confident downgrading to begin with is right on this hand in the long run btw.

Mikeh, in the OP alludes to this. Phil outright would open 1NT. And you, deep down, know it is right to open it 1NT.

 

Maybe, It's a 1NT opener. I know nobody downgrades at your level, but you could lie about seeing one of the Jacks, in the postmortem. Me, I have no reputation to worry about, so it is easy to open 1NT.

Looks like routine 1NT for me. An d I have reputation of upgrading a lot. :)

 

In fact 1nt with 4333 18 HCP has produced an Ave- and 3 close to tops in pairs. I started doing that in the last fall.

[OleBerg]

A fitting number of NT's, rightsiding what is 90%+ likely to be the final denomination.

[cherdanno]

Even when we don't have a stopper 2NT might work best - making 2N beats whatever contract goes down after we bid 2H.

[mike777]

Very strong preference for 2N, I'm fine calling Jxx a stopper. Even if they can run the suit they often will fail to (LHO not leading from AQ at MP).

 

I think there are far far far more layouts where we need to declare when we have a stopper. Kxx in dummy with AQ on our left, and Axx in dummy with KQ on our left being the most obvious. Yes opposite either of those if RHO has Hx it plays better from partner's side, but given their vulnerable overcall I think that is way less likely.

 

Even when partner has Ax LHO might choose to underlead the heart, or not lead the heart at all.

 

Meanwhile I think our prospects in any contract other than NT when we have no stopper are quite bleak. Our hand is just garbage for anything else.

ya....

[mike777]

Even when we don't have a stopper 2NT might work best - making 2N beats whatever contract goes down after we bid 2H.

yes

[andy_h]

Anyone up for 1♠ if you don't like 2NT?

[gnasher]

Anyone up for 1♠ if you don't like 2NT?

Doesn't that show a weak notrump with only three spades? That's taking downgrading a bit far.

[whereagles]

2♥ seems normal. I would try 3♥ if and only if that asked "got a stopper pard?"

[gwnn]

jlall and jdonn: 2NT

whereagles: not 2NT, we have no stopper! doh!

[pooltuna]

[hv=d=s&v=b&s=sak6hj87dakqcj642]133|100|Scoring: MP

You deal and, in deference to Milton Work, open 1♣. LHP bids 1♥ and partner's negative double comes back to you. What do you bid?[/hv]

i'm going to call 2♥ not because it shows a big hand but because I want to bail out as cheaply as possible with many of partner's possible -X holdings. I too think you should have bit the 50 cal. bullet and just called 1NT.

[dburn]

[hv=d=s&v=b&s=sak6hj87dakqcj642]133|100|Scoring: MP

You deal and, in deference to Milton Work, open 1♣. LHP bids 1♥ and partner's negative double comes back to you. What do you bid?[/hv]

2♥. I already pretended to have an eighteen count. I'm not going to pretend to have a heart guard also.

[Phil]

2♥. I already pretended to have an eighteen count. I'm not going to pretend to have a heart guard also.

You won't stay in the Cool Guy club very long evaluating hands like this.

[mikeh]

The hand didn't develope as I have posted, because responder held QJxx in spades with a soft 4=3=5=1 6 count (all queens and jacks) and chose to pass. I hold a question and answer each week before the game, where the idea is to encourage questions about hands from the previous week...we have hand records for this game.

 

I was asked what one should rebid if the auction had included a negative double, and had to say that I wasn't at all sure what was best.

 

But the reason I said that I was fairly sure that I wouldn't bid 2♥ is that in my book it creates a force, such that responder can take a call without fear that opener will pass at his next opportunity.

 

Thus with a good hand and a good club fit, for example, responder might bid 3♣ to show the fit, confident that opener won't pass. Then what??

 

I don't like making bids that promise another call and then passing: responder will think he has no need to jump or recue...he can show where he lives and then show strength, if he holds it, next time.

 

Do any of the 2♥ bidders have any thoughts on this?

[Phil]

Do any of the 2♥ bidders have any thoughts on this?

I'll reiterate my desire to open 1N.

 

However, I'm on the record for 2♥. Its not that I love it, but I like 2N less, although I have been swayed by the 2N bidders. This hand does look very 'no-trumpy' and if you choose not to open 1N because its too strong, this is a reasonable valuation in spite of the shaky stop.

 

If I started with 2♥, I would hope for a 2♠ stall from partner that would let me clarify my hand, and I would with 2N.

 

If I heard 3♣ I would bid 3N but I wouldn't least comfortable about it, except I hope partner could infer that my heart stopper isn't very robust since I didn't bid NT the 1st time.

[cherdanno]

So by bidding 2H instead of 2NT you are committing to showing a game forcing single suiter with a heart stopper, instead of showing 18-19 hcp balanced with a heart stopper (what else does cuebid-then-NT show?) Great.