Another hand from the club

[jillybean]

[hv=d=n&v=b&s=sahtdat94caqj8752]133|100|Scoring: MP

P (1♦) 2♣ (P)

2♦* (P) ?[/hv]

 

2♦ shows a good, 10-11, 3-4 card ♣ raise

[Jlall]

I'd start with 3D

[whereagles]

4NT. This has potential.

[Siegmund]

I wonder if a jump to 4♣ would get partner to tell me about his DK or HA. If I just cuebid 3♦ I will hear about major stoppers which really isn't what I want to hear about. I dislike 4NT, mostly because I won't know what if anything we're making even after I hear the keycard answer.

 

Lacking good methods, setting the contract at 5♣ doesn't feel SO bad even at MPs.

[jdonn]

3♦ then (presumably) 4♣ next should get partner to cuebid a diamond control if he has one. That seems like a good start.

[655321]

3♦ no problem yet.

 

Although if partner does bid 3M I don't think I would bid 4♣ next, it sounds too much as though we were looking for 3NT and gave up when there was no diamond stopper opposite.

[jdonn]

3♦ no problem yet.

 

Although if partner does bid 3M I don't think I would bid 4♣ next, it sounds too much as though we were looking for 3NT and gave up when there was no diamond stopper opposite.

If you feel that won't be forcing, which is reasonable, then I would prefer simply bidding 4♣ now which I think has to be forcing. Anything to get a diamond cuebid.

[jillybean]

ok, over:

 

3♦:3♥

 

4N:5♥

 

4♣* would be minorwood I think, so you get a 4♠ response

[hanp]

I think that 4C after 3D.. 3H is forcing, if we were looking for 3NT we could have bid 3S.

 

That's what I'd do and hopefully it isn't minorwood.

[Free]

I'd start with 3♥

[Jlall]

Wow I def do not think 4C is forcing after 3H, we are in a defensive auction slam is not our priority, and even if slam is our priority there are a million ways to try for slam there's only one way to stop in 4C.

 

If it goes 3H I would bid 3S. We still have not clarified our intentions at all, but if it goes 3N we can bid 4C it's clear we have diamond and spade controls and partner can cuebid diamonds. If partner bids 4C over 3S (also non forcing to me!), we can bid 4D and it's clear what has been going on.

 

I guess I do not see how useful in general having 4C as a slam try is going to be, with a slam try usually im fine bidding 3S or 4D for now. I do see how it could be useful when we made an aggro 3D bid and partner made a bid we don't like so now we're trying to sign off. On this hand as I have a spade control I don't understand wanting to bid 4C anyways, even if it's forcing I would think it denied a spade control.

[ONEferBRID]

I realize "real bridge players don't use RKC" but what more does Overcaller need after the good Cl support? He has at least 2nd Rnd Ctrl in all side suits:

 

P  (1♦) 2♣ (P)

2♦! (P) 4♣! = Minorwood

 

If you choose the cuebidding route, does 3H over 3D! help you if it is the King ?

You really want to find out about key cards first and outside K's next.... if it comes down to that.

 

Edit: With Minorwood you can stop in 5C, if need be, whereas it may be too late to put the brakes on if 4NT is used.

[whereagles]

ok, over:

 

4N:5♥

6♣ now.

[jillybean]

I think that 4C after 3D.. 3H is forcing, if we were looking for 3NT we could have bid 3S.

 

That's what I'd do and hopefully it isn't minorwood.

P (1♦) 2♣ (P)

2♦!:3♦

3♥:4♣ is this not minorwood?

 

edit: now that I have read Justins post, apparently it's not

[Cyberyeti]

I'd start with 3♥

This was my thought, I don't want partner to value K♥ unless he also has the A.

[jillybean]

[hv=d=n&v=b&n=sq972ha983djck943&s=sahtdat94caqj8752]133|200|Scoring: MP

P (1♦) 2♣ (P)

2♦[/hv]

 

Here's the full hand, 7♣ making with a 1-1 club split.

[Phil]

Did you bid it (big WD!).

 

Usually getting to 6 is enough on these types of hands.

[Echognome]

I would think the easiest route there would be:

 

P - (1♦) - 2♣ - (P);

3♦ - (P) - 4NT - (P);

5♥ - (P) - 7♣ - AP

[Phil]

I would think the easiest route there would be:

 

P - (1♦) - 2♣ - (P);

3♦ - (P) - 4NT - (P);

5♥ - (P) - 7♣ - AP

What exactly is 3D here? Looks like a splinter but that isn't clear (or even preferable).

 

Not even sure you and I came to a clear consensus.

[Echognome]

I would think the easiest route there would be:

 

P - (1♦) - 2♣ - (P);

3♦ - (P) - 4NT - (P);

5♥ - (P) - 7♣ - AP

What exactly is 3D here? Looks like a splinter but that isn't clear (or even preferable).

 

Not even sure you and I came to a clear consensus.

Jump cue above the suit must be splinter. Below the suit I would say mixed raise (e.g. P - (1♣) - 1♦ - (P); 3♣...)

 

My point being that a splinter is the easiest way to find the grand. Whether we are worth a splinter (and forcing to 3NT/4♣) is another issue with our hand. As a PH with 4-card support, I think we are.

[jillybean]

Did you bid it (big WD!).

 

Usually getting to 6 is enough on these types of hands.

Nope, hence the forum post :ph34r:

[Fluffy]

3♦ would be perfect today gnome, but seems to bury the major's fit when there is one.

 

Minorwood didn't help this time, if you could bid 4♣ slam try over 2♦ you'd get a 4♦ response and you are on your way to grand, partner could have ♦Kxx but that is very pessimistic.