What's that mean?

[blackshoe]

Bidding goes (uncontested) 1♦-1♥-4♣-5♣.

 

4♣ is a splinter in support of hearts. What's 5♣?

[ArtK78]

It can't be a great hand with no first-round controls in the pointed suits, which was my first thought. In that case, responder could just bid RKCB.

 

In order to by-pass RKCB, responder must be showing a very specific hand-type. So I would guess it is a heart-club 2 suiter with very good clubs - AKJTx(x) or better. Perhaps something like:

 

xx

QJTxx

x

AKJTx

 

Opener should evaluate his hand with the idea that responder's club suit is a source of tricks, even opposite a known singleton.

[Bende]

If 4♣ can be a singleton then I would think 5♣ shows the ace. Otherwise, I don't know.

[whereagles]

lacking specific agreements, I'd say it's a club control. Which should be the ace, since nothing else makes sense.

[Jlall]

It shows the ace of clubs and no spade/diamond controls.

[Mbodell]

When this auction occurs in the real world across all bridge players what percentage of the time do you think it is an offer to play in clubs because the player forgot about splinters?

 

With how many hands can you force to the 5 level but not bid 4♦ or 4♠ or 4nt?

[Jlall]

When this auction occurs in the real world across all bridge players what percentage of the time do you think it is an offer to play in clubs because the player forgot about splinters?

 

With how many hands can you force to the 5 level but not bid 4♦ or 4♠ or 4nt?

Well if you have no spade control you cant bid 4S or 4N. I don't think this is such an unusual auction, you have good trumps and the ace of clubs and too much to last train. KQJxx of trumps and the CA is a good example hand. For people who don't know last train it is even more common since they'll never bid 4D on the marginal hands.

 

I think this is a more common auction than bidding 5H with good trumps and no controls anywhere.

[hijumper]

It can't be a great hand with no first-round controls in the pointed suits, which was my first thought. In that case, responder could just bid RKCB.

 

In order to by-pass RKCB, responder must be showing a very specific hand-type. So I would guess it is a heart-club 2 suiter with very good clubs - AKJTx(x) or better. Perhaps something like:

 

xx

QJTxx

x

AKJTx

 

Opener should evaluate his hand with the idea that responder's club suit is a source of tricks, even opposite a known singleton.

What is the point to show your long club suit after partner's splinter on it?

 

I would think 5c as inquiry about c and partner answer as, in the case that trump is major, 5d void and 5H singlton.

[Fluffy]

Barring specific methods its a bluhmer bid. It will only make sense with good trumps, no club loser and lack of red controls.

[jdonn]

Barring specific methods its a bluhmer bid. It will only make sense with good trumps, no club loser and lack of red controls.

So isn't that another way of saying cuebid lol?

[aguahombre]

Barring specific methods its a bluhmer bid. It will only make sense with good trumps, no club loser and lack of red controls.

So isn't that another way of saying cuebid lol?

yep

[blackshoe]

Try this auction: (P)-1♥-(2♥)-4♣-(P)-5♣-(P)

 

Still a cue bid? (2♥ is Michaels, spades and a minor). What do you bid over 5♣ with [hv=s=sq72hkt95dak987c3]133|100|[/hv]

[rogerclee]

Try this auction: (P)-1♥-(2♥)-4♣-(P)-5♣-(P)

 

Still a cue bid? (2♥ is Michaels, spades and a minor). What do you bid over 5♣ with

Dealer: ????? Vul: ???? Scoring: Unknown

♠ Q72 ♥ KT95 ♦ AK987 ♣ 3

You should be missing a spade control.

[blackshoe]

<nod> So, 5♥ I guess.

 

Actually, partner has ♠AKJ and ♣K972, and clearly did not recognize that 4♣ was a splinter (for one thing there was no alert).

 

Declarer made 5♥ for 10 of 15 MPs. :ph34r: [hv=d=s&v=e&n=s986543hjd3caqt86&w=sakjha6432dtck972&e=sq72hkt95dak987c3&s=sthq87dqj6542cj54]399|300|Scoring: MP[/hv] Two pairs made only four, and three pairs went down one, probably in 6♥.

 

I didn't rotate this to make S the declarer. Declarer was actually West.

[Tomi2]

Try this auction: (P)-1♥-(2♥)-4♣-(P)-5♣-(P)

this is a totaly different auction because here you have to agree if you play splinters or fit-jumps! so pd could either forget about your agreement or don't know it (or you forget/don't know)

 

for me this is like comparing 1NT-2♣ where 2cl is stayman and nobody forgets it to 1♠-2♣ and asking "could he have forgotten, that 2♣ is stayman?"

[mcphee]

Sorry, if my partner thinks 5C is now a good C suit we will need to discuss the principle of what a splinter shows and the suit it identifies as trumps. The A of C and no pointed suit controls but slam interest is what most will expect.

[blackshoe]

this is a totaly different auction because here you have to agree if you play splinters or fit-jumps!

Fair enough. But it seems to me that first, both meanings (splinter and fit jump) require an alert, and second, if you bid 4♣ intending it as a splinter, and partner alerts and bids 5♣, do you bid 5♥ intending to sign off? Do you seriously consider other calls? Third, if partner doesn't alert, does that constrain your choices?

[jdonn]

this is a totaly different auction because here you have to agree if you play splinters or fit-jumps!

Fair enough. But it seems to me that first, both meanings (splinter and fit jump) require an alert, and second, if you bid 4♣ intending it as a splinter, and partner alerts and bids 5♣, do you bid 5♥ intending to sign off? Do you seriously consider other calls? Third, if partner doesn't alert, does that constrain your choices?

Both meanings are alertable so I don't see it tells you anything unless they ask.

[Rodney26]

this is a totaly different auction because here you have to agree if you play splinters or fit-jumps!

Fair enough. But it seems to me that first, both meanings (splinter and fit jump) require an alert, and second, if you bid 4♣ intending it as a splinter, and partner alerts and bids 5♣, do you bid 5♥ intending to sign off? Do you seriously consider other calls? Third, if partner doesn't alert, does that constrain your choices?

The 4C bid is post-alertable. Bids should be explained at the conclusion of the auction before opening lead has been made. Partner is not supposed to alert during the auction for bids over 3NT (except on the first round).

 

1H-4C! (alert)

1D-1H-4C (post-alert)

 

So, you're not constrained since so far you've followed the rules correctly.

 

I still don't quite see why 5C is seen as so unusual. xx AQxxx Qx Axxx or the like.

[gnasher]

I know this isn't the question you were asking, but I play an immediate raise of a splinter as "Inclusion Keycard": partner responds to Keycard, but treats a void as the ace.

 

The idea is that 4NT says "I'm not interested in hearing about a void", so that there's no risk of responder's jump getting in the way of opener's grand-slam tries.

[hanp]

I play it shows the ace and denies a diamond or spade control.