jú

[gwnn]

xxxx

KQJ7xx

xx

x

 

imps unfav 1st seat you decide to.. pass

 

it goes

 

p-1♣-x-p

3♥-4♣-x-p

???

[olliebol]

Think partner has 18/19 balanced and so would bid 4 hearts.

[Codo]

4 ♥

[the hog]

Agree with 4H.

[Free]

4♥

[nige1]

xxxx KQJ7xx xx x

imps unfav 1st seat you decide to.. pass

it goes

p-1♣-x-p

3♥-4♣-x-p

???

IMO 4♥ = 10, _P = 6, 4♠ = 4.

[pooltuna]

xxxx

KQJ7xx

xx

x

 

imps unfav 1st seat you decide to.. pass

 

it goes

 

p-1♣-x-p

3♥-4♣-x-p

???

I need a seat on the 4♥ bandwagon

[jjbrr]

xxxx

KQJ7xx

xx

x

 

imps unfav 1st seat you decide to.. pass

 

it goes

 

p-1♣-x-p

3♥-4♣-x-p

???

I need a seat on the 4♥ bandwagon

move over, i'm coming in too.

[aguahombre]

yep, 4H --in case partner didnt see the 3H bid.

 

http://forums.bridgebase.com/index.php?showtopic=38864

[Phil]

Why didn't I bid 4♥ last time? Or even 3♥ the 1st time?

 

(and to think I'm the resident underbidder around here)

[gwnn]

seriously you'd open 3♥?

[jdonn]

I would definitely open 2 in first seat.

[Phil]

seriously you'd open 3♥?

I just saw the vul.

 

I'm opening at least 2.

 

But only 3♥ after a x. Really?

[gwnn]

yea not sure about that.. looked like an OK value bid at the time (mind you I don't like the philosophy of bidding 3M on 5 cards)

 

anyway I didn't like partner's double on

 

AKQxx

T

KQx

Kxxx

 

at least he had the courtesy to bring the T :P

 

all's well that ends well: LHO had all aces along with the stiff spade

[aguahombre]

2H seems to be clear on the first round, but I thought we were accepting the conditions. If OP is living with a first round pass, and thinks 3H the next time has described his hand as an advance to the double, then why not abide by partner's decision to double 4C?

[gwnn]

partner doubled 1C, he can't have a perfect penalty double of clubs unless he has like 24 points, say

 

Ax

Ax

AKx

AKJTxx

.

 

This is not the same as

 

3♥-(4♣)-x

 

With this post I do not mean to say that partner's double should be pulled very often or it should be pulled at all. I am quite unsure about this sequence, but it is definitely not as clear as you make it out to be aguahombre.

[aguahombre]

The point I was making was that, if you feel you have described your hand, and partner then makes a decision, you don't want to over-ride it.

 

If one of you has made a bad choice, oh well. This is not a perfectly clear situation, but certainly the idea of describing and then subsiding is reasonable. On this hand, partner thought you had pretty much what you had.

[gwnn]

the question is,

 

is partner's double a clear signal that this is his final decision?

 

the answer is unclear to me.

 

the answer is clear to you.

 

the question this thread endeavored to ask was not

 

"Hi I'm gwnn, my partner made a clear penalty double, may I pull it? Thank you for your kind help"

[aguahombre]

The answer is to exactly that question. Of course you can pull a penalty double. But you don't want to do so if your hand is already what you said it was.

[gwnn]

but partner's double is clear penalty only to you aguahombre, apparently the rest of the thread doesn't think so.

 

It is not impossible to have the agreement that double just shows a lot of extra values but not too many hearts. This hand would be typically 19 ish balanced as olliebol mentioned.

[bill1157]

yea not sure about that.. looked like an OK value bid at the time (mind you I don't like the philosophy of bidding 3M on 5 cards)

 

anyway I didn't like partner's double on

 

AKQxx

T

KQx

Kxxx

 

at least he had the courtesy to bring the T :P

 

all's well that ends well: LHO had all aces along with the stiff spade

seems like a horrible TO double, 1♠ is right.

 

Bill

[jdonn]

I do not like partner's double at all...

[mikeh]

There are two schools of thought (maybe 3?) about our 3♥ call. I assume that the OP meant 3♥ as stronger than 2♥, whereas I belong to the school that says that 3♥ is an unusual hand type...6 or 7 hearts, weak suit, weak hand..it is semi-preemptive, as well as descriptive. I had thought that was the standard meaning, but I was reading an old (but not ancient) BW the other day and in the MSC there was a real split on the meaning.

 

Anyway, I would have opened 2♥; would have bid 4♥; and would bid 4♥ now, unless somehow I felt that I had shown a 4=6 good suit hand.

 

Partner's double of 1♣ suggests that he learned to play bridge in the 1970s or earlier, or that he is at best an intermediate player. It has been standard to overcall 1♠ on this hand-type for decades.