ATB - unanimous?

[jillybean]

[hv=d=n&v=n&n=sq975hk973d2cj875&s=sk642hadqj84cakq6]133|200|Scoring: IMP

P (P) 1♦ (P)

1♥ (P) 1♠ AP[/hv]

[gwnn]

n passed.. why?

[TylerE]

50/50.

 

Both should have bid 1 more spade.

[kayin801]

I like to give a courtesy bump to 2S with the north hand, known 8 card fit in the master suit and far from a useless hand, makes it harder for them to balance when opener has 7 points fewer, and we get to games when opener has hands like this.

 

Debateable whether S is worth a jump shift, not the worst 19 count ever but it feels a little meh just on instinct.

 

80/20 N/S

[ArtK78]

North 110%.

 

Yes, South has a great hand. But I fully understand not wanting to consume bidding space by jumping on a bad 4 card suit with a 3 suited hand. South could have avoided the disaster by jumping, but I cannot find fault with a simple rebid of 1♠.

 

North, on the other hand, has a good hand in support of spades. North should realize that if the South hand has fitting cards and an above-average opening bid game should have good play. Anytime the South hand consists of minimal wastage in diamonds, 4 good spades and some other cards game is good, and South is certainly not jumping just because he holds those cards.

 

I suppose a more rational allocation of the blame would be 90% to North, 10% to South, as South could have prevented the disaster by jump rebidding. But the pass by North is just inexcusable.

[PhantomSac]

I like the 1S bid, the pass is atrocious. Even if you don't like 1S, it is certainly a marginal decision (19 points, but stiff honor in partner's suit, no 5 card suit, 13 points outside the suit you open + JS in is meh, pretty bad hand overall), whereas passing 1S has absolutely no merit.

[jdonn]

I blame north! Can't blame south since I would have bid the same way myself.

[kenrexford]

I agree 100% north.

 

If there's any debate about 1♠, consider this:

 

On this actualy layout, 4♠ seems really good, but... You start out with four club tricks, two hearts, and a spade. The defense starts out with two Aces. The defense has a real good shot at a second spade trick, and a club ruff, or a bad spade split, could spell doom. If game is not laydown with support, a ruffing value, two clear covers, and six working HCP, none of which was shown by 1♥, then GF is not clear at Opener's rebid.

[jillybean]

I liked my partners reason for passing 1♠ ("12+5 could be too high, your hand is too good for a 1♠ redbid") only slightly less than those suggesting south bid 2♠.

[dicklont]

I liked my partners reason for passing 1♠ ("12+5 could be too high, your hand is too good for a 1♠ redbid") only slightly less than those suggesting south bid 2♠.

12+5 leaves 23 for the opps.

In that case 2♠ is preemptive, so it is never wrong.

 

And 12+6 leaves 22.

[Little Kid]

Wouldn't ever dream of passing 2♠ with North hand, nice 4card support and not a minimum response. Even if you are thinking of limiting partner to 17 or so, game could still easily make opposite an unbalanced hand with ♣ shortage or so. Blaming the missed game on opener's failure to rebid 2♠ seems like resulting. Even if game is not going to make, 2♠ by responder rates to be a good competitive decision.

 

Don't see anything wrong with 1♠ rebid, its not the best 19 ever with the (singleton honour in partner's suit, scattered values, no texture, no source of tricks, etc). Maybe it is is worth a GF, but I certainly prefer 1♠ because it leaves more room to explore and partner shouldn't pass it on hands like this, making 1♠ safe.

[vuroth]

"12+5 could be too high"

If you evaluate north's hand at 5 after the 1♦ open, do you really still evaluate it has 5 after the 1♠ rebid?

[jillybean]

"12+5 could be too high"

If you evaluate north's hand at 5 after the 1♦ open, do you really still evaluate it has 5 after the 1♠ rebid?

You are asking the wrong person.

[the hog]

Looks like it is unanimous. I think passing 1S is very poor. I would also have bis 1S with the strong hand.

[aguahombre]

I don't pass 1/1/1, period. This one would be farrrrrrr from the exception.

[neilkaz]

North really has to raise here to show 4 card support and to cater to opener having a hand like this or something with a tad less HCP but more unbalanced.

 

This means that opener doesn't have to JS unless he can be really sure of GF and that can make finding slams a bit easier, IMHO.

 

Passing 1/1/1 is not good unless you semi-psyched the 1 and have 3 card support for the second suit and don't have enough cards in opener's first suit to return to it.

 

For those that don't respond 1/1 a bit light, they basically should almost if not totally never pass 1/1/1, IMHO.

 

Just my opinion ... neilkaz ...

[peachy]

N 100%. Pass was a bad.

[gwnn]

i like passing with as much as a soft 8 count, provided you have a stiff in partner's suit and 3 card support. those hands generally play very well in a 4-3, but need a lot of pep to be able to play game. passing with 4 cards is very bad and I can almostnot think of any hands that would do that.

[NickRW]

I liked my partners reason for passing 1♠ ("12+5 could be too high, your hand is too good for a 1♠ redbid") only slightly less than those suggesting south bid 2♠.

I think you should stop liking your partner's reason for passing:

 

1) Lacking a means of bidding strong 4441 hands, your 1♠ rebid is reasonable, especially with 2 not very strong suits and a stiff honour in partner's first suit.

 

2) If your side has the minority of the high cards and you have a known 8 card fit, meaning they probably have one too, then they're probably coming over the top of 1♠ - and in which case North is having to bid 2♠ anyway. Give them the harder problem by bidding it straight away.

 

100% North's problem in my view.

 

Nick

[jillybean]

Nick. I think the irony was missed, I detest my partners reason for passing.

[aguahombre]

Nick. I think the irony was missed, I detest my partners reason for passing.

the irony was not missed here, jilly...but you also questioned your own 1S rebid, and I --as well as others--think the 1S rebid was very well judged. The two actions should not be even barely compared to one another. Yours was very good, the pass of 1S was very wrong.

[NickRW]

Nick. I think the irony was missed, I detest my partners reason for passing.

Oh yeah, irony, the 5th suit - sorry - appears I held a void again!

[pooltuna]

[hv=d=n&v=n&n=sq975hk973d2cj875&s=sk642hadqj84cakq6]133|200|Scoring: IMP

P (P) 1♦ (P)

1♥ (P) 1♠ AP[/hv]

why does North think he is suddenly captain after 1♠?

[lmilne]

if he's captain, then who is the crew?

[MinorKid]

We play new suit forcing, so i do not encounter this kind of problem much. B)