Overcall over strong club

[Little Kid]

(1♣)*-1♠-(Pass)-2♣?

 

*1♣ is strong, 15+

 

What does 2♣ mean?

[rogerclee]

Natural

 

1NT = strong raise

[helene_t]

Natural. Nonforcing even if you play 2/1 forcing over normal overcalls.

[jjbrr]

Natural

 

1NT = strong raise

This.

[jdonn]

But isn't it disgusting how often at the club an opponent overcalls 2♣ as michaels or such?

[PhantomSac]

A big mistake people make is to be in "destructive bidding mode" after 1C 1X pass. Usually the pass shows something like 0-4 or 0-5. At that point it is not unlikely at all to be your hand, and it really isn't unlikely that you have a game either. Just bid normally, and as roger said use 1N as your cuebid.

 

Here 2C is showing a club suit and some values. You are bidding constructively. Don't do this with a lead directional raise because you might play in 2C, and you aren't telling partner you have a fit (he might want to bid game if he knew you had one). Don't bid with a yarb, because partner might take you seriously.

 

Contrast this to if RHO had shown values somehow, then you can basically do whatever you want.

[helene_t]

But isn't it disgusting how often at the club an opponent overcalls 2♣ as michaels or such?

never seen that. But I once saw 2♣ in the OP auction intended as a good raise. Partner passed it and went 5 off vulnerable.

[PhantomSac]

But isn't it disgusting how often at the club an opponent overcalls 2♣ as michaels or such?

never seen that. But I once saw 2♣ in the OP auction intended as a good raise. Partner passed it and went 5 off vulnerable.

It happens a lot.

 

1C ALERT

 

Then they don't ask and bid 2C = michaels 100 %.

 

1C ALERT

 

think think think WHAT IS THAT? OH, STRONG, OK!

 

2C = clubs.

 

Basically happens every time actually.

[1eyedjack]

If giving up a natural 1N I think I might prefer to make the bid under 2S as the strong raise (ie in this case 2H) and all lower bids (incl 1N) to be transfers. But perhaps that just gives oppo more bites at the cherry. No strong feelings really.

[PhantomSac]

If giving up a natural 1N I think I might prefer to make the bid under 2S as the strong raise (ie in this case 2H) and all lower bids (incl 1N) to be transfers. But perhaps that just gives oppo more bites at the cherry. No strong feelings really.

One of my partners and I discussed playing transfers here. We decided not to because having more room opposite the cuebid is very useful (1 under good raise leaves no room for a last train, let alone showing your second suit or w/e). Also, as you said it just gives them too many ways in. I mean can you imagine if they got to bid

 

1C 1S p 1N(clubs)

2C=michaels. It would feel gross. Alternatively they could X and X, pass then X for a light takeout etc etc.

 

The advantage of responder being very strong without a fit and able to transfer and bid again is pretty rare after a strong club and an overcall, but possible. Being able to make a lead directional raise is nice in theory, but it gives them a lot of room compared to directly raising, so in practice I rarely make the lead directing raise anyways. My goal is to win the auction or push them as high as possible/make them bid as inaccurately as possible at that point, the lead is secondary.

[Little Kid]

Cool, thanks for the quick responses! I was in the 2♣ seat a few minutes ago with a limit raise in spades and had no clue what to do. Ended up bidding 2♣ because I also held 5♣s, not being 100% sure what it would mean. I was certain there must be some "standard" way to show a good ♠ raise. Never knew that people play 1N as a limit raise here but it makes more sense than giving up the natural club bid :)