ATB Defense

[rogerclee]

[hv=d=e&v=n&n=s2hqj876djt8xc9xx&w=s9xxxht9xdxxxcakx&e=sajxxhakxdaqcqjtx&s=skqt8hxxdk9xxc8xx]399|300|Scoring: MP[/hv]

 

2N P 3N AP

 

MP vs bad opps

 

UDCA, no smith

 

Lead: ♠K (asks for attitude)

 

1) ♠K - low - 2 - low

2) ♣8 - K - 9 - low

3) ♦low - low - Q - low

 

-400

[billw55]

Why did south duck the diamond?

[Jlall]

Ducking the DQ is lol. North should encourage clubs imo so that his partner knows not to get in and play a spade (the 2 looks encouraging unless it's stiff 2), so that might be a mistake, but it shouldn't induce south to duck the diamond. In fact, clarifying the club position should make it very obvious to south not to duck the diamond because declarer has club length, so arguably north made a good play.

 

People need to stop trying to be brilliant with these ducks, if you are not good then just win queens with your kings or stuff like this will happen over and over and over /rant.

[gnasher]

Why did south duck the diamond?

Because he thought declarer might have AJxx AQ AQJ QJ10x

[Jlall]

Why did south duck the diamond?

Because he thought declarer might have AJxx AQ AQJ QJ10x

Is that what he thought? Then why didn't partner give count with T8x? Just being tricky?

 

and then why can't declarer have AJxx AQ AQx QJTx also? Or any number of hands. It is just ludicrous.

[Jlall]

Ok this is what I said in private, but it sums up how I feel:

 

1) It might be possible for parnter to have not given count with T8x (it can't really cost as far as I can tell, but often partner can falsecard in the first suit they play)

 

2) It might be possible to give them a guess by ducking when partner has not given count, or when they have AQJx

 

3) You might gain if they guess the play wrong later, because they burn their entry

 

All of these things are possible. However, it's also possible you are just losing a trick outright, as in them having AQ or AQx (note AQx should be more likely than AQJ, because partner cannot afford to split JTx for bridge reasons).

 

My primary goal is going to be to not lose a trick outright, and to assume partner has signalled well unless he simply could not (ie, low from JTx is very possible, declarer could have KQ9xx). This will always be true unless I have a very solid and sound reason for thinking that there is a specific layout that exists where ducking is right. As of right now, I really have no reason to suspect that layout to be more likely than any other layout, and I'm not gonna risk something stupid like this. It is imo a complete hero play by someone who has read 1 too many books.

[wclass___]

I would suggest different ATB

 

1) ♠K - low - 2 - ♠A

2) ♠J

[jdonn]

I agree south was being way too clever. No need to try and be a genius because it beats (probably) on a particular layout when it costs on so many more.

 

Any criticism of north for discouraging clubs is possibly correct (or possibly not) but definitely obscure, he gets little to no blame. In fact I think discouraging clubs might have made it easier for south.

[Pict]

Perhaps more to the point is whether any of you would have ducked the spade, putting a sure contract on the floor.

[Jlall]

Perhaps more to the point is whether any of you would have ducked the spade, putting a sure contract on the floor.

Why is that more to the point? Sometimes your opponents make mistakes, it is your job to capitalize on them. Obviously south had some read from the tempo that RHO had ducked. If our opps always played perfectly, we'd never win.

[Pict]

Fine - I 'agree' with the idea of taking the diamond King.