You did that to yourself

[ochinko]

Imps, all white, partner deals and opens 1♦. You have [hv=d=n&v=n&s=sqxhqjxxxdxxxcxxx]133|100|Scoring: IMP[/hv]

You bid 1♥, and partner bids 2♠. If undo and pass is not an option how do now you curb your partner's enthusiasm?

[jjbrr]

If you have 2NT conventional available with one option being "slow down, partner" I would bid that.

 

If not, I guess you're stuck bidding 3♦

[the hog]

Serves you right for bidding 1H on that rubbish. Agree with a conventional 2NT, otherwise 3D.

[gwnn]

the thread title reminded me of The Devil's Advocate movie when Charlize Theron told Neo "HE DID THIS TO MEEEE" and Neo said no, you're insane, you did this to yourself.

 

I agree with the Hog and the awesome avatar.

[kenrexford]

I'd respond 1♥ and then bid 2NT conventionally.

[nigel_k]

I agree with the 1♥ response and bid 3♦ now. If given the option with the benefit of hindsight, I would not choose to take 1♥ back as game could easily make. Partner would have bid 1♠ on many of the hands where it doesn't.

 

In this sequence I'd prefer not to play 2NT as conventional showing any weak hand. Why risk wrongsiding 3NT when opener's range is defined fairly closely so we don't need to use the space to find out more about strength?

[the hog]

I agree with the 1♥ response and bid 3♦ now. If given the option with the benefit of hindsight, I would not choose to take 1♥ back as game could easily make. Partner would have bid 1♠ on many of the hands where it doesn't.

 

In this sequence I'd prefer not to play 2NT as conventional showing any weak hand. Why risk wrongsiding 3NT when opener's range is defined fairly closely so we don't need to use the space to find out more about strength?

I think you are missing the point of the 2NT bid, Nigel. It is not to find out opener's range, but rather to allow you to stop in 3D, (or 3H on other hands with longer Hs), where responder has rubbish as in the posted hand. Such a "blackout" bid, forcing 3C is common in many partnerships.

[straube]

The knr for Qx QJxxx xxx xxx is 3.4. Too weak to respond imo.

 

After 1D-1H, 2S I like 2N. This bid leaves the most room for partner to describe his shape.

 

But shouldn't I show a diamond fit?

 

I don't think so. It's kind of like using 1N forcing to give partner a bad 3-card raise of his major. Partner doesn't know if I have a bad hand or bad support (or both) but he's discouraged from bidding more.

 

With xxx of diamonds and a subpar hand, I don't want to encourage partner to explore slam (perhaps subsiding in 5D) when 3N is our best spot.

[mike777]

Imps, all white, partner deals and opens 1♦. You have [hv=d=n&v=n&s=sqxhqjxxxdxxxcxxx]133|100|Scoring: IMP[/hv]

You bid 1♥, and partner bids 2♠. If undo and pass is not an option how do now you curb your partner's enthusiasm?

easy 1h

easy 3d now

 

I got all my bids. easy.

[655321]

3♦ seems obvious.

 

We have no vestige of a club stopper, and we have a preference for diamonds over spades. To pass 2♠ my hand would need to be a fair bit worse (as well as having 3 spades and fewer diamonds).

[cherdanno]

Yeah 3♦ and I like my chances of winning a game swing against the "I NEED 6 HCP TO RESPOND"-crowd.

[jdonn]

Why are people saying "ha that'll teach you to respond on that!" We haven't gone down yet you know. Plenty of hands give good play for game here. Anyway 3♦ stands out to me.

[mich-b]

Auto 1♥ response, and auto 3♦ now.

Actually I have some good things : a fit for partner's main suit, and an honour in his 2nd suit.

 

I think we are quite likely making 3NT or 5♦ , or maybe 4♥.

 

And I don't understand conventional 2NT showing weakness, or preparing a signoff. This is applicable opposite a reverse which is not GF. But 2♠ here was 100% GF , so not possible to stop in partscore. 2NT is very likely to wrongside the eventual 3NT.

[rogerclee]

Auto 1♥ response, and auto 3♦ now.

Actually I have some good things : a fit for partner's main suit, and an honour in his 2nd suit.

 

I think we are quite likely making 3NT or 5♦ , or maybe 4♥.

 

And I don't understand conventional 2NT showing weakness, or preparing a signoff. This is applicable opposite a reverse which is not GF. But 2♠ here was 100% GF , so not possible to stop in partscore. 2NT is very likely to wrongside the eventual 3NT.

agree with all these words

[ewj]

I agree too.

1♥ is just automatic :)

[P_Marlowe]

Hi,

 

3D.

 

I did respond on submin. values, but p 2S bid made my hand stronger,

the Queen is good, we have a diamond fit, I woubld be happier, if we

discovered a heart fit, but you cant have everything, and p may still have

3 hearts, so no need to worry.

 

Even if you dont have 2NT as art. av., 3D is basically your weakest raise,

since you have 3C available.

 

With kind regards

Marlowe

 

PS: I would have passed playing standart, but may have responded with

my regular p, since we have mechanism to stay low.

[kenrexford]

The 2NT bid (if conventional) does not have a sole purpose of stopping in a partscore. It also has the benefit of distinguishing a values 3♦ from a crud 3♦, both below 3NT, and the same for spade raises, etc.

[Codo]

Thanks to Gonzalo I reread the auction, so silly stuff deleted...

 

1♥ and 3 ♦, heading for 4♥ or 5 ♦

Edited January 26, 2010 by Codo

[Fluffy]

wtf 2NT? 2♠ is GF, how can we slow down when we are in a GF sequence?

 

3♦ and see if partner can bid 3♥/NT otherwise we will e stuck to play 5♦.

[Simplicity]

i think 1♥ and 3♦ now are automatic. I'll be pretty pleased if we play in 4♥ or 3NT, 5♦ might not be so hot but we ain't down yet

[mcphee]

Responding 1H is why you were given that suit to bid. It is not your fault you have a weak hand, not your fault if partner does not know what a j/s looks like, which is GF. I am delighted to see that my 1H bid (as some may pass which is silly imo) is getting us to a game.

 

I also like the 2NT toy, although many do not play this after a j/s, to help define my response. BTW I can construct hands on the weak side of a j/s that will make 12 tricks, AKxx Ax AKxxxx x one such example needs 2-2 trumps and K king onside. I am laughing at those who feel pass is the right action.

[Jlall]

The 2NT bid (if conventional) does not have a sole purpose of stopping in a partscore. It also has the benefit of distinguishing a values 3♦ from a crud 3♦, both below 3NT, and the same for spade raises, etc.

Wrongsiding 3N is a pretty huge downside.

[kenrexford]

The 2NT bid (if conventional) does not have a sole purpose of stopping in a partscore.  It also has the benefit of distinguishing a values 3♦ from a crud 3♦, both below 3NT, and the same for spade raises, etc.

Wrongsiding 3N is a pretty huge downside.

I thought about that, but I think this is illusory. Here's why.

 

Responder is also allowed to think. He will only bid 2NT when he intends on raising diamonds or spades. If Responder wants to transfer 3NT to Opener, he can bid 3♣.

 

On this hand, I'm not sure that the right-siding is a concern. If Opener has a reasonably-expected 4-1-5-3 hand, where 3NT is in play, I as Responder want the lead. Qx in hearts opposite Kxx, for example, seems right-sided when the Qx holding declares. Plus, with QJxxx in hearts, opposite a hypo heart stiff, I'd rather receive the lead than be forced to pop Jack when the lead goes through hearts.

 

Sure, with some weak hands I might be forced to bid 3♣ to right-side 3NT. But, I can live with that.

 

Also, I agree that this reduces the utility of a 2NT call to hands with lead tolerance in the unbid suit and weak, or no intention of leaving the contract in 3NT, but I think this happens enough.

 

On a different note, I personally don't like the requirement that a jump shift to the two-level be 100% GF, actually. This only occurs in four auctions: 1♣-1♦-2♥, 1♣-1♦-2♠, 1♣-1♥-2♠, and 1♦-1♥-2♠. In all four, I'd actually rather have the two-level jump shift treated as almost game force. The primary reason is that a one-up response (1♦-1♦ or 1♦-1♥) is a call that I often make (by agreement) as a semi-Herbert call (might be three-card on occasion and might be VERY light). That general agreement suggests the need for the 2NT relay (or possibly 1♣-1♦-2♥-2♠ as ING.). For those who would pass 1♦ and now see a problem, this illustrates the reason. As a person who I would guess also bids when in doubt, "in doubt" being quite shocking to others, I bet you can at least understand my reasoning.