Jlall Posted January 8, 2010 Report Share Posted January 8, 2010 KQJ KQJ KQJ xxxx. MP. You play 14-16 NT. Would you? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Free Posted January 8, 2010 Report Share Posted January 8, 2010 "good players never downgrade, experts do"? :blink: I wouldn't. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ant590 Posted January 8, 2010 Report Share Posted January 8, 2010 No way, unless I'm playing with GIB. I'd show it as the bottom of the next balanced range (17-19?). If partner has enough to GF opposite an average 17-count, he's likely to bring enough to the party to make it worth my while not opening 1NT imho. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mbodell Posted January 8, 2010 Report Share Posted January 8, 2010 I would in 3rd or 4th. I wouldn't in 1st or 2nd. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nigel_k Posted January 8, 2010 Report Share Posted January 8, 2010 I would. Good players evaluate accurately and then bid aggressively based on that valuation. If that means downgrading then so be it. This is easily closer to 16 than 17. If a good player would open a 14-16 NT with an average 16 then they can do it with this too. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Codo Posted January 8, 2010 Report Share Posted January 8, 2010 I would not. I have 6 tricks this is too much for a 14-16 opener. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gnasher Posted January 8, 2010 Report Share Posted January 8, 2010 I'd treat it as a 17-count. I don't think it merits a two-point downgrade. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OleBerg Posted January 8, 2010 Report Share Posted January 8, 2010 Maybe in fourth seat, matchpoints, opp. red. Not otherwise. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jlall Posted January 8, 2010 Author Report Share Posted January 8, 2010 I think I partially did it just so I could say I downgraded by 2 points at some point in my life heh. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
billw55 Posted January 8, 2010 Report Share Posted January 8, 2010 I wouldn't downgrade this at all - 18 points! Every honor has a buddy, every jack is as good as a king. Those are big plusses. OK, no aces or spots with the honors are minuses, but overall I call that a wash, not a downgrade. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jlall Posted January 8, 2010 Author Report Share Posted January 8, 2010 I wouldn't downgrade this at all - 18 points! Every honor has a buddy, every jack is as good as a king. Those are big plusses. OK, no aces or spots with the honors are minuses, but overall I call that a wash, not a downgrade. lol Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
billw55 Posted January 8, 2010 Report Share Posted January 8, 2010 lol ;) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pooltuna Posted January 8, 2010 Report Share Posted January 8, 2010 KQJ KQJ KQJ xxxx. MP. You play 14-16 NT. Would you? Definitely a 1♦ opener with a NT rebid ;) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Old York Posted January 8, 2010 Report Share Posted January 8, 2010 I would always downgrade by 1 point - but not 2, there are 3 negative features4333 is bad, no aces is bad, all hcp in short suits is bad I was amazed to see that this hand is valued as 15.4 on the K&R Evalualor, so maybe I should downgrade more often http://www.jeffgoldsmith.org/cgi-bin/knr.cgi Tony Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MickyB Posted January 8, 2010 Report Share Posted January 8, 2010 Feels pretty close to a double-downgrade, no strong feelings. Did you miss game? ;) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kenrexford Posted January 8, 2010 Report Share Posted January 8, 2010 IMO, a "downgrade" is not really what it seems to be by the words used. Rather, what I vbiew as happening is that a range is used that is not equivalent to the Works HCP analysis. When you translate what your range really is into the HCP definition, sometimes it appears to be a downgrade or upgrade. Hence, If the range means that this hand fits in a HCP world as roughly a "14-16 HCP" hand, you are not really downgrading. To be consistent, then, I would also "downgrade." Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MickyB Posted January 8, 2010 Report Share Posted January 8, 2010 KQJ KQJ KQJ xxxx. MP. You play 14-16 NT. Would you? Definitely a 1♦ opener with a NT rebid ;) You mean you are downgrading to 11-13? Bit excessive IMO Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
655321 Posted January 8, 2010 Report Share Posted January 8, 2010 Not me. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pooltuna Posted January 8, 2010 Report Share Posted January 8, 2010 KQJ KQJ KQJ xxxx. MP. You play 14-16 NT. Would you? Definitely a 1♦ opener with a NT rebid ;) You mean you are downgrading to 11-13? Bit excessive IMO I did not say a one NT rebid I just said a NT rebid probably two Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mikegill Posted January 8, 2010 Report Share Posted January 8, 2010 Count me in for downgrading if I have even the slightest bit of respect for my opponents' defense. Surely partner is going to put us in game with two aces (or even and A and a K!) opposite 17-19, and it sure seems like that will frequently have no play whatsoever. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
whereagles Posted January 8, 2010 Report Share Posted January 8, 2010 never downgrade lol. 1 pt at most, but 2 is too much eheh Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
neilkaz Posted January 8, 2010 Report Share Posted January 8, 2010 KQJ KQJ KQJ xxxx. MP. You play 14-16 NT. Would you? I'll downgrade to the SAYC or 2/1 typical 15-17, but really don't want to downgrade by 2 pts if playing 14-16. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fred Posted January 8, 2010 Report Share Posted January 8, 2010 If you had this hand in a Robot Reward Tournament would you open at all? Would the vulnerability matter? Fred GitelmanBridge Base Inc.www.bridgebase.com Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jdonn Posted January 8, 2010 Report Share Posted January 8, 2010 If you had this hand in a Robot Reward Tournament would you open at all? Would the vulnerability matter? Fred GitelmanBridge Base Inc.www.bridgebase.com Yes I would only open vul. But I wouldn't open with 1NT since gib passes with 8.. :ph34r: I think downgrading by 2 points on a balanced hand is pretty ridiculous, not to mention the pleasure of opening in your xxxx isn't so good either! But if someone just wants a story then who am I to question? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jlall Posted January 8, 2010 Author Report Share Posted January 8, 2010 If you had this hand in a Robot Reward Tournament would you open at all? Would the vulnerability matter? Fred GitelmanBridge Base Inc.www.bridgebase.com I wouldn't Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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