ewj Posted December 21, 2009 Report Share Posted December 21, 2009 [hv=d=s&v=n&s=sakqhjxxdajxxxcqj]133|100|Scoring: IMP[/hv] You deal and open 1♦ which shows 4, LHO overcalls 2♣ and partner bids 2♦, your go... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hanoi5 Posted December 21, 2009 Report Share Posted December 21, 2009 3♣ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Free Posted December 21, 2009 Report Share Posted December 21, 2009 3♣ WTP Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
655321 Posted December 21, 2009 Report Share Posted December 21, 2009 2NT Doesn't overstate my values, lets partner out in 3♦ if he likes. Overstates my club stopper a touch - if we end up in 3NT going down when LHO has AKTxxx and leads them from the top, next board! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hrothgar Posted December 21, 2009 Report Share Posted December 21, 2009 What would a 1NT opening have shown?(Personally, I think that this looks like a 15-17 HCP 1NT) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ewj Posted December 21, 2009 Author Report Share Posted December 21, 2009 Not a huge fan of downgrading 18 counts with 5 card suits tbf :ph34r: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mcphee Posted December 21, 2009 Report Share Posted December 21, 2009 We are not always able to be completely accurate with our bidding. I feel 2N should imply a C stop which I almost have. The problem with 3C is will partner look at 10xx in C and say 3N I have a C stop? Being the nice partner I am I bid NT now and take whatever blame there may be. After all we do not want partner to say "sorry" when they have 10 3rd for missing 3N. I would have down graded this hand and opened 1N 5 card suit and all, this is not a nice hand. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hrothgar Posted December 21, 2009 Report Share Posted December 21, 2009 Not a huge fan of downgrading 18 counts with 5 card suits tbf :ph34r: I don't expect the decision to downgrade to be popular. For whatever reason, folks always seem to be looking for opportunities to upgrade, but never to downgrade. This hand has three HCPs wasted in the form of QJ tight. A lot of the offensive strength is in the form of the AKQ tight in spades. This will definitely take three tricks, but seems unlikely to establish anything in partner's hands. The Jxx in Hearts isn't encouraging either. Don't get me wrong. I very much like the AJ fifth in Diamonds, epsecially when partner had shown a fit. However, I think that the negatives with this hand FAR outweigh the positives. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OleBerg Posted December 21, 2009 Report Share Posted December 21, 2009 2♠ Wtp? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Phil Posted December 21, 2009 Report Share Posted December 21, 2009 Not a huge fan of downgrading 18 counts with 5 card suits tbf :ph34r: I don't expect the decision to downgrade to be popular. For whatever reason, folks always seem to be looking for opportunities to upgrade, but never to downgrade. This hand has three HCPs wasted in the form of QJ tight. A lot of the offensive strength is in the form of the AKQ tight in spades. This will definitely take three tricks, but seems unlikely to establish anything in partner's hands. The Jxx in Hearts isn't encouraging either. Don't get me wrong. I very much like the AJ fifth in Diamonds, epsecially when partner had shown a fit. However, I think that the negatives with this hand FAR outweigh the positives. Agree with Richard. AJxxx doesn't compensate for the QJ / Jxx negatives. Even AKQ tight isn't appealing. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gwnn Posted December 21, 2009 Report Share Posted December 21, 2009 downgrading into is better than out of 1NT, but I don't like it on this hand. For one, we can get in our suit now. I hate tp. :ph34r: I will have to bid 2NT but I'm not happy about it. But 3♣ will not do anything, do we really expect partner to stop clubs? He will bid 3♦ 98% of the time and then we will be sad. Pass has some appeal but I'm not mature enough for it yet. :) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
andy_h Posted December 21, 2009 Report Share Posted December 21, 2009 No qualms about 2NT at all. LHO doesn't always have to have AKT-6 for a w/r overcall. And I disagree about downgrading our hand. I don't see QJ as a huge negative for all we know they could be great filler cards. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
aguahombre Posted December 21, 2009 Report Share Posted December 21, 2009 Yep, looks like 1NT. But now that you sat in the seat of the 1D opener, will you take advantage of the opening bid mistake to even further downgrade and pass based on what followed? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gnasher Posted December 21, 2009 Report Share Posted December 21, 2009 3♣ will probably work if partner bids 3NT over it, because my club holding will go back up in value. If he doesn't, however, he might carry us too high, thinking that a 10-count with no club wastage is a good hand. 2NT works most (all?) of the time that 3♣ does, and also if LHO underleads ♣AK and the diamonds are running. However, LHO didn't overcall 3♣, so he is quite likely to have a side card. If that is ♥A or ♦K, he ought to lead clubs from the top, and 3NT will go quite a lot down. Another downside of 2NT is that partner will pass it when he has a poor hand with only three diamonds, which again may cost a bit at the vulnerability. This hand has become really bad. It's not just the club holding: it's also the fact that partner is unlikely to have much length in the majors, so my major-suit holdings aren't pulling their weight either. It's a bit committal, but I pass. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fluffy Posted December 21, 2009 Report Share Posted December 21, 2009 I pass for sure, what game can we make? do we expect partner's 2♦ to have ♥ stopped, ♣ stopped and diamonds running?, how is that possible? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gwnn Posted December 21, 2009 Report Share Posted December 21, 2009 xxx Qx Kxxxx Txx he won't accept the invite but you can't say it's impossible Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hrothgar Posted December 21, 2009 Report Share Posted December 21, 2009 The 1♦ opening promised four pieces.This looks like a raise to 3♦ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nigel_k Posted December 21, 2009 Report Share Posted December 21, 2009 I tend to agree with Hrothgar that opening 1NT is better though it is close. At different scoring or vulnerability it would be different though my preference with limited bids like a 1NT opening is that responder may stretch for vulnerable games but the 1NT opener just bids his hand normally. So 1NT is fine in that case because it isn't worth more than an average 17. The actual problem is a tough one. My first thought was I would like to pass, but partner doesn't have many options over 2♣ and might have bid 2♦ on a decent hand and/or with a five card major so pass is not an option and I was leaning towards 2NT. But when I started to construct hands, there aren't that many where game makes. Gwnn's example where partner has ♣10 and ♥Q and the diamonds run is one of them. There are some hands where we might make four of a major as well, eg Jxxxx Kx Kxxx xx but probably there a larger number where we'll go down in four of a major if we keep bidding. It's optimistic to hope that LHO will underlead AK when he likely has another entry somewhere. I now think pass is the best percentage action but don't know if I could bring myself to do it at the table. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mikeh Posted December 21, 2009 Report Share Posted December 21, 2009 I would never downgrade....sure, it is a horrible 18 count, but it is still 18....with a 5 card suit....until LHO bids....now it's 15. The problem with downgrading is that partner may hold a big hand, and will refuse to consider slam with, say, a decent 14 count because you 'can't' have the fillers he needs. Having said that I see this as an easy pass at this juncture. If I were to bid, it would be 2N......no way am I bidding 3♣. QJ tight will often be a stopper because LHO will often lead low...but the bidding suggests that he will choose a high one if he holds AK, as he rates to do....he rates to hold an entry. I would expect that bidding will generate 2 to 3 times as many minus scores as it leads to making (and biddable) games....altho on many hands it will lead to the same +110 or +130 as would passing. Edit: I have gone back into the thread and see that Andy wrote a better version of my answer before I got here :) I couldn't (and didn't) have said it better than that. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MFA Posted December 21, 2009 Report Share Posted December 21, 2009 2NT.I think pass is a big position here that I would never take. We are vul at imps, no way I can pass. Being vul vs not also means that partner could have passed some completely hopeless hands instead of trying a subminimum 2♦. 2NT>3♣, because I really want to maximize my chance of getting to 3NT when it's right. It may cost when they run clubs against me in 2NT or 3NT but I'm willing to risk that. Also my hand is only invitational, perhaps 3♣ will induce partner to overbid. But 3♣ is ok also.2NT>2♠ because I want 2♠ to show four when partner easily could have a four-card major. If I bid 2♠ with 3 I need a follow-up plan if I get raised. Originally downgrading this to a 15-17 1NT opening is borderline LOL in my opinion. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OleBerg Posted December 21, 2009 Report Share Posted December 21, 2009 Originally downgrading this to a 15-17 1NT opening is borderline LOL in my opinion.In my opinion it is just borderline. http://www.wrongdiagnosis.com/b/borderline...order/intro.htm Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wclass___ Posted December 21, 2009 Report Share Posted December 21, 2009 2NT I don't think that LHO should lead from top, and difference between QJ-K-Kx is not THAT big. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mike777 Posted December 21, 2009 Report Share Posted December 21, 2009 1) agree with 1d...dont downgrade2) as others have mentioned responder bidding 3d and not 2d would have solved the issue.3) 2d is pretty wide ranging for me so must bid 2nt now. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lamford Posted December 21, 2009 Report Share Posted December 21, 2009 Pass, and quite quickly; I am quite well placed if LHO has another go; take away the queen-jack of clubs, then I pass quite slowly as I don't want to hear from him again ... just joking. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Siegmund Posted December 22, 2009 Report Share Posted December 22, 2009 I can see a case for 2NT but 3C feels more honest. Can't really imagine passing - though I do expect to end in 3D fairly often. I am assuming the 2D is natural 6-9. Am I the only one in the world who likes to play Inverted still on after doubles and suit overcalls (but off after 1NT overcalls)? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Join the conversation
You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.