kfay Posted December 8, 2009 Report Share Posted December 8, 2009 [hv=d=e&v=b&s=saj8763h85dk2cj95]133|100|Scoring: IMP(P)-?[/hv] Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jdonn Posted December 8, 2009 Report Share Posted December 8, 2009 Well it's not a stupid question, but I think 2♠ is way too dangerous. I have a bias against preempting with balanced hands in general, and preempting with bad suits when vul. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
andy_h Posted December 8, 2009 Report Share Posted December 8, 2009 Under the conditions, definitely no. 6322 and the suit is pretty horrible for vul and 2nd. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jonottawa Posted December 8, 2009 Report Share Posted December 8, 2009 I bid 2♠. WTP. Good spots. Good description of overall strength and hand's best feature. Equal vul. Spoiler: I went and found the hand. I was gonna say that as long as pard has stiff 9, this won't be a disaster. Pard had stiff 9 and 2♠ is a winner. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
whereagles Posted December 8, 2009 Report Share Posted December 8, 2009 sure, but it can backfire of course Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gwnn Posted December 8, 2009 Report Share Posted December 8, 2009 2♠, I'm callin a spade a spade. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jlall Posted December 8, 2009 Report Share Posted December 8, 2009 I'd pass Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kfay Posted December 8, 2009 Author Report Share Posted December 8, 2009 Spoiler: I went and found the hand. I was gonna say that as long as pard has stiff 9, this won't be a disaster. Pard had stiff 9 and 2♠ is a winner. I think you forgot to mention, that spades split 3-3, the Ace of hearts is onside, partner has two bullets and they can't manufacture any ruffs. Aside from the stiff spade partner has an average++ hand and you could easily be -2 or more. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Phil Posted December 8, 2009 Report Share Posted December 8, 2009 Pass. Takes some discipline to do this, but this hand has SO many negatives: - The suit is marginal- 6322 sucks- Two defensive tricks which mitigates their ability to make a high level contract- 2nd seat red, so partner should expect something more. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mikeh Posted December 8, 2009 Report Share Posted December 8, 2009 Swimming against the tide: I'd open. i wouldn't, at unfavourable, but I can't imagine passing this. Just because I see it as close, doesn't mean I don't see it as clear. Thus, if we took away the spade J and made it the 10, it would still be close, for me, but clear to pass. So I guess I know where I draw the line. I don't think that the result on the hand, once revealed, would change my mind, altho a simulation might. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Trinidad Posted December 8, 2009 Report Share Posted December 8, 2009 In the old days we learned not to open a weak two with a singleton (too many alternative suits to play in). And now we hear that 6322 sucks. While I agree that 6322 sucks, what kind of hand are we supposed to have for a weak two? A 6222 maybe? Having said that I would pass on this hand because I don't like the suit quality. Rik Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bluecalm Posted December 8, 2009 Report Share Posted December 8, 2009 You can't win if you pass. Clear 2S for me. I would open some weaker hands too. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jonottawa Posted December 8, 2009 Report Share Posted December 8, 2009 Spoiler: I went and found the hand. I was gonna say that as long as pard has stiff 9, this won't be a disaster. Pard had stiff 9 and 2♠ is a winner. I think you forgot to mention, that spades split 3-3, the Ace of hearts is onside, partner has two bullets and they can't manufacture any ruffs. Aside from the stiff spade partner has an average++ hand and you could easily be -2 or more. Continuing the invisible argument: :P Pard had a stiff, so of course you need some good things to happen. Nothing miraculous, just good luck from there. 2♠ rates to be %. You might bid a filthy red game. It's a good lead direct. You get your hand off your chest. Once in a blue moon you'll go for a number into nothing, unlucky, that's bridge. Just as often, Righty will reopen (required to get that number you're worried about) and Lefty will go for a number into nothing. What mikeh said. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nigel_k Posted December 8, 2009 Report Share Posted December 8, 2009 It's close but the hand is quite defensive so I'd pass. If I had KQ instead of AJ I would open because my trick expectation is about the same but theirs is higher. Also would definitely open in any seat except second. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MFA Posted December 8, 2009 Report Share Posted December 8, 2009 2♠ wtp. Come on, bridge is not about waiting for perfect hands and expecting disasters with every flaw. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jdonn Posted December 8, 2009 Report Share Posted December 8, 2009 Joining the invisible argument...Once in a blue moon you'll go for a number into nothing, unlucky, that's bridge. We must live in different climates, because what you consider a blue moon I think is quite common. I think you have grossly exagerated. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hanoi5 Posted December 8, 2009 Report Share Posted December 8, 2009 I have a bias against preempting with balanced hands in general, and preempting with bad suits when vul. Did you pay 2000? I did, now I'm careful when overcalling at the 2 level with bad hands/bad suits. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jdonn Posted December 8, 2009 Report Share Posted December 8, 2009 I have a bias against preempting with balanced hands in general, and preempting with bad suits when vul. Did you pay 2000? I did, now I'm careful when overcalling at the 2 level with bad hands/bad suits. There are 3 related issues to having both a bad suit and a suit headed by just the ace:- The opponents are more likely to catch you when you are in trouble, because instead of trumps like A9xx or AKxx they have more attractive holdings to pass like KQTx.- The opponents are less likely to be making something when you do go for a number.- You go for quite a lot of smallish 200 and 300 numbers even when they don't double you, and in those cases the opponents invariably don't have game. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pooltuna Posted December 8, 2009 Report Share Posted December 8, 2009 I have a bias against preempting with balanced hands in general, and preempting with bad suits when vul. Did you pay 2000? I did, now I'm careful when overcalling at the 2 level with bad hands/bad suits. There are 3 related issues to having both a bad suit and a suit headed by just the ace:- The opponents are more likely to catch you when you are in trouble, because instead of trumps like A9xx or AKxx they have more attractive holdings to pass like KQTx.- The opponents are less likely to be making something when you do go for a number.- You go for quite a lot of smallish 200 and 300 numbers even when they don't double you, and in those cases the opponents invariably don't have game. I have paid 1100 for overcalling 2♣ red vs white and I am a lot more careful at those colors now :) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
aguahombre Posted December 8, 2009 Report Share Posted December 8, 2009 One thing I am sure of: it ain't a stupid question. I chose "could go either way", at risk of being misunderstood :) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jlall Posted December 9, 2009 Report Share Posted December 9, 2009 In the old days we learned not to open a weak two with a singleton (too many alternative suits to play in). And now we hear that 6322 sucks. While I agree that 6322 sucks, what kind of hand are we supposed to have for a weak two? A 6222 maybe? Having said that I would pass on this hand because I don't like the suit quality. Rik The old days sound like they suck! lol. Never heard of not preempting with a singleton. Crappy suit, side defense, and 6322, and 2nd seat vul all suck to me for preempting. Would never do it with this hand. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jdonn Posted December 9, 2009 Report Share Posted December 9, 2009 I have actually seen it in books where the "ideal" weak 2 opening is something like KQJxxx xx Kxx xx. Usually old books. Very old. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
suokko Posted December 9, 2009 Report Share Posted December 9, 2009 I would need 7th spade to open weak 2 with this hand type. My partner except more from me in this zone and position so I'm quite often down one in 4 spades if I open this. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Apollo81 Posted December 9, 2009 Report Share Posted December 9, 2009 Everything is wrong for preempting. The suit is bad AND headed by the ace, the hand has 1.5+ defensive tricks, you're in 2nd seat, and you're vulnerable. I can live with a few of these, but not ALL of them. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fluffy Posted December 9, 2009 Report Share Posted December 9, 2009 Opening in second position vulnerable you need a constructive hand, your main objective is to find your best game/part score faster than opps. This is a minimum for opening under this conditions, but I'd open, I love the ♣J9x thing. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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