Didn't Count Cards

[Chris3875]

I came to the table to find that both North and West had started play with 14 cards - South and East both had only 12. Obviously everyone had failed to count their cards at the start of play !

 

Rightly or wrongly, I gave them both an Average Minus and sorted out the board. But what would I do if this had been a Team event? (I know what to do if only one side had made an error in a Team event but not both!)

[blackshoe]

If the board had not been played at the other table, and was not part of some kind of movement where it would be played by other teams (which is often the case here) I'd just redeal it.

 

At what point in the hand did you discover this?

[JoAnneM]

Re: if a team event - Commonsense says that since the infractions occurred at both tables (the first table fouled the board, the second table didnt' count) the board should be thrown out. I don't know what the Law says.

 

Obviously if this happened at the first table it would just be redealt.

[Chris3875]

Well .. this scenario didn't actually happen - I was just wondering what the situation would be if it DID happen !

 

Let's say that Board 8 had already been played at the other table in a Swiss Teams event - but this table had received a fouled board from the previous table (not their partners) - FAILED TO COUNT THE CARDS prior to commencing play - and with 3 cards to play suddenly discovered the problem - what then ?

[shintaro]

Well .. this scenario didn't actually happen - I was just wondering what the situation would be if it DID happen !

 

Let's say that Board 8 had already been played at the other table in a Swiss Teams event - but this table had received a fouled board from the previous table (not their partners) - FAILED TO COUNT THE CARDS prior to commencing play - and with 3 cards to play suddenly discovered the problem - what then ?

;)

 

If you are sure that it was misboarded after the other table in the match has played it then assuming you have time you could give each of the 2 teams a pre-duplicated board each so they can play the same board cancelling the misboarded one

 

:unsure:

[Trinidad]

In a Swiss team event, you give both teams -3 IMPs on the board.

 

As an example, the score on the other boards would be 33-21. Now team A will get a score of 33-24 or a victory by 9 IMPs. On the WBF 8 board VP scale, this converts to 18 VPs for A.

 

Team B will get a score of 21-36 or a loss bij 15 IMPs. On that same scale, they will get 10 VPs.

 

The result of the match is therefore 18-10.

 

You will do the same if you play Swiss teams according to Win/Loss/Tie. Suppose that without this board the score would have been 43-40. Team A now will get a score of 43-43 or a tie. And team B will get 40-46 or a loss.

 

The only problem comes when you have knockout teams. After all, you cannot knockout both teams.

 

Rik

[blackshoe]

A contestant who causes an adjusted score at another table may also rate a PP - so at the table where the misboarding occurred, assuming you can identify the culprits, you might consider that as well.

[bluejak]

Just to remind some people: in most of the world these days, the old idea of dealing boards at the table in Swiss Teams has been abandoned, so usually the same physical boards are not played at both tables. Everyone plays the same duplimated boards - far better. Over the weekend I have just had in Llangollen I was able to talk to other teams about hands, eg where a certain North Wales pair was proud of bidding a grand slam. Of course it needed two finesses and a suit break, but it made!

 

In the given scenario, the official and legal answer is you give them Ave-/Ave- in Pairs or Teams. The exception is that sometimes in teams you will feel able to play a substitute board. While this is fairly normal in k/o teams, in most forms of teams you would not bother.