olliebol Posted November 1, 2009 Report Share Posted November 1, 2009 I read in a recent topic that experts seldom downgrade before certain evidence tells them so. In what kind of situations would you downgrade? For a starter i would offer xxx in a suit bid or overcalled on my right. off course there a many more.... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Little Kid Posted November 1, 2009 Report Share Posted November 1, 2009 I'm not quite sure what exactly you mean by downgrade. Are you referring to considering a hand is worth less than its value in hcps? Or is it certain situations, auctions and seats in which given holding might not pull their full weight? Or both? Regarding hcps: 4333s, stiff honour(s), lack of intermediates, queens and jacks rather than ace and kings, lack of filling honours in your long suit... I probably wouldn't downgrade a hand for any single one of these on reasons but might do so with a combination (eg. I wouldn't think of QJx QJx QJx QJxx as an opening hand). Situational: singleton K/Q/J in suits that the opponent left of you has shown a LOT of strength in is good reason to assume the holding won't be worth what it usually is. A 1NT overcall behind you, especially holding a lot of finessable honours like queens and kings. Holdings like xxx in a suit bid by your RHO means your p will have the missing honours if they need to be finessed, so that is bad. Basically whenever you have good reason to assume you or your partner's honours will be under the enemy honours is not a good sign. I tend to be quite optimistic though and very rarely downgrade a hand, I think it doesn't very happen you can be sure a given hand is worth less. You definitely don't want to be missing games just because you 'may' have your stiff king dropped. But then again I'm not an expert either so I may be wrong :) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gwnn Posted November 1, 2009 Report Share Posted November 1, 2009 theres no stopping if you start downgrading left and right. it's a sneaky, slippery slope! :rolleyes: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
vuroth Posted November 2, 2009 Report Share Posted November 2, 2009 I pretty much never downgrade. That said, I held something close to: KJx KJx KJx Kxxx the other day, and refused to open 1NT. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gwnn Posted November 3, 2009 Report Share Posted November 3, 2009 why? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
vang Posted November 3, 2009 Report Share Posted November 3, 2009 because it looks like 13 (14) points: http://www.jeffgoldsmith.org/cgi-bin/knr.c...Jx+KJx+KJx+Kxxx Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
aguahombre Posted November 3, 2009 Report Share Posted November 3, 2009 From what I have seen, most of the regulars on BBO forums upgrade much more often than they downgrade. And as a general rule, without any examples, that is probably wise. Better players figure they will gain by better play in marginal contracts at IMPS. As Far as NT openers are concerned, I downgrade a tick for KQ tight, QJ tight and let the rest of the clever point counting variances remain mildly interesting. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
andy_h Posted November 4, 2009 Report Share Posted November 4, 2009 Agree with aqua, except I don't downgrade KQ or QJ tight when I'm only considering the opening of NT. Usually most downgrading occurs during mid auction when the information infront of you provides you with a fair idea of the honour locations and know how well (or bad) your honours are placed with respect to it. In general, just remember to not underestimate Aces and not overestimate stray queens and jacks. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pooltuna Posted November 4, 2009 Report Share Posted November 4, 2009 Agree with aqua, except I don't downgrade KQ or QJ tight when I'm only considering the opening of NT. Usually most downgrading occurs during mid auction when the information infront of you provides you with a fair idea of the honour locations and know how well (or bad) your honours are placed with respect to it. In general, just remember to not underestimate Aces and not overestimate stray queens and jacks. WHAT!!! A voice of reason in the wilderness??? :D Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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