UI?

[Rossoneri]

I was asked for an opinion, this took place in a private league match where there wasn't any director present.

 

[hv=d=n&v=n&n=sk72hdkt3cakqjt73&w=sqt86hak74d954c92&e=sa943hqt32dj872c4&s=sj5hj9865daq6c865]399|300|Scoring: IMP

[/hv]

 

The bidding was: 1♣ P 1♥ P 3NT P(1) P(2) P(3)

 

(1) East passed immediately after the jump rebid

(2) South took 15 seconds before passing

(3) Hesitation claimed by NS. EW disputed this. W also stated that he was entitled to pause and think after N's jump rebid.

 

East led a the ♥2. 3NT-3 was the final result. North is claiming that west's hesitation helped in finding an unusual heart lead as there was no other plausible reason to hesitate. East expressed that a heart lead is standard to him after the auction.

 

All 4 players at the table are either current or former internationals.

[axman]

I was asked for an opinion, this took place in a private league match where there wasn't any director present.

 

[hv=d=n&v=n&n=sk72hdkt3cakqjt73&w=sqt86hak74d954c92&e=sa943hqt32dj872c4&s=sj5hj9865daq6c865]399|300|Scoring: IMP

[/hv]

 

The bidding was: 1♣ P 1♥ P 3NT P(1) P(2) P(3)

 

(1) East passed immediately after the jump rebid

(2) South took 15 seconds before passing

(3) Hesitation claimed by NS. EW disputed this. W also stated that he was entitled to pause and think after N's jump rebid.

 

East led a the ♥2. 3NT-3 was the final result. North is claiming that west's hesitation helped in finding an unusual heart lead as there was no other plausible reason to hesitate. East expressed that a heart lead is standard to him after the auction.

 

All 4 players at the table are either current or former internationals.

I find it curious that the W cards suggest any action other than pass. As W in fact passed it might be inferred that he was not contemplating bidding [had his chance at the one level] and thus was contemplating something else. If that something else was the likelihood of setting the contract that best could have been done after the auction. As such his lengthy pause [W’s assertion that he was entitled to pause after N’s skip is strong evidence he did pause even though he asserts he didn’t] suggests values, values in an unexpected place. I would think that for players of international caliber and experience that such inference would not be lost upon E or W. I am thinking that W’s pause approaches a breach of L73B for such a player.

 

As for E, he did not help matters. I believe that mandatory pauses** after skip bids minimize the likelihood of a multitude of player’s problems. The time for W’s thinking should have been provided by the pause that E didn’t perform. That S was not given the expected? pause his taking 15sec ought not be considered a variation in tempo.

 

**Presuming mandatory pauses are not prohibited

 

Personally, I believe that a fourth best heart is not particularly out of the ordinary; but not a standout option [no option is stand out]. Also, in this auction I would expect declarer to value a spade lead, and holding the ace, I have some reluctance to leading a spade, but not dramatically adverse to it but I would anticipate it is tantamount to giving up the prospect of setting the contract.

[blackshoe]

East may call it "standard to him", but that doesn't make it a standard lead.

 

East's failure to pause after the jump bid may or may not be an infraction under Singapore regulations, I don't know. Even if it is, though, South's 15 is a bit more than he should get. As for West, after South's 15, West has got all the time he deserves.

 

Has East taken advantage of UI? I don't know. Even assuming there was a BIT by West (did he argue that it wasn't a bit because[/b] he's "entitled to pause"? If so, he's wrong) I don't see that it demonstrably suggests a heart lead. On the other hand, I'm certainly not on their level as a player, so maybe I'm missing something.

 

Edit: Cross posted with Axman, whose point about 73B is interesting. I hadn't considered that aspect.

[Rossoneri]

Do you think then, a PP is in order?

[Trinidad]

For me, after this auction, I don't need to look at my hand to lead a heart. It is THE standard lead on this auction. (The fact that a heart lead is THE standard lead doesn't mean though that there are no LA's.)

 

I do agree that it is very odd for West to pause here and let's -for now- agree that we can assume that he did break tempo. But what UI did the BIT convey? The only thing that I can come up with is that West might have considered a double. Therefore one needs to examine what a double by West would have meant. If a double would have asked for a heart lead, then there is an irregularity and we may adjust. If a double asked for something else, then the UI didn't suggest the heart lead and we don't adjust.

 

Another important point: If all 4 players are (former) internationals, I really can't see how EW beat 3NT. On the heart lead, you play the 8 from dummy (what other card would you play?) and you discard diamonds from your hand when they take the first three tricks. When West then leads spades in trick 4, you don't really have an option either and you play low from hand. EW get three hearts and the ♠A. 3NT making. I would consider it a major error if a player of North's caliber went down in 3NT.

 

This gives me the feeling that NS may be upset about North's declarer play and project it on the opponents. This gives me enough reason to take a closer look and I would check the facts again. Was there really a BIT by West?

 

Rik

[gnasher]

Another important point: If all 4 players are (former) internationals, I really can't see how EW beat 3NT.

West switches to a spade, either before or after cashing the three hearts, and North has a guess. When he misguesses, he loses 4 spades and 3 hearts, for down three.

[Jlall]

Heart is a totally automatic lead on this auction for an expert imo. You should almost always be leading a heart on this auction the way most people bid, and certainly when it is your best suit it is obvious.

 

The north hand is very typical. People have stoppers in the unbid suits and long running clubs for this auction. Ergo they have short hearts. That is also the suit they may not have stopped. They also have short hearts because they aren't interested in playing hearts. Even with Hx of hearts they may be worried about shutting partner up at this point in the auction sometimes. The only question is which heart to lead, the queen could definitely be right, but that's pretty irrelevant on this hand.

 

This is a really well known situation, and similarly it is standard to lead Q from Qxx of hearts or J from Jxx of hearts if you have that holding on this auction also.

[Cyberyeti]

Heart is a totally automatic lead on this auction for an expert imo. You should almost always be leading a heart on this auction the way most people bid, and certainly when it is your best suit it is obvious.

 

The north hand is very typical. People have stoppers in the unbid suits and long running clubs for this auction. Ergo they have short hearts. That is also the suit they may not have stopped. They also have short hearts because they aren't interested in playing hearts. Even with Hx of hearts they may be worried about shutting partner up at this point in the auction sometimes. The only question is which heart to lead, the queen could definitely be right, but that's pretty irrelevant on this hand.

 

This is a really well known situation, and similarly it is standard to lead Q from Qxx of hearts or J from Jxx of hearts if you have that holding on this auction also.

This explanation is pretty much exactly what I'd have said, although I think the normal heart to lead is the Q or 10 (give partner K97x and declarer the same void to see why the 10 might be better than the Q, and declarer a singleton 9 to see why it might be better than a small one, serious loss only to stiff J).

[PeterE]

(3) [...] W also stated that he was entitled to pause and think after N's jump rebid.

 

[snip]

 

All 4 players at the table are either current or former internationals.

astonishing, appalling :( ;) :)

[Rossoneri]

(3) [...] W also stated that he was entitled to pause and think after N's jump rebid.

 

[snip]

 

All 4 players at the table are either current or former internationals.

astonishing, appalling :( ;) :)

More astonishing: West himself is a qualified club TD.

[bluejak]

Another important point: If all 4 players are (former) internationals, I really can't see how EW beat 3NT. On the heart lead, you play the 8 from dummy (what other card would you play?) and you discard diamonds from your hand when they take the first three tricks. When West then leads spades in trick 4, you don't really have an option either and you play low from hand. EW get three hearts and the ♠A. 3NT making. I would consider it a major error if a player of North's caliber went down in 3NT.

Switch the ♠A and the ♠Q and "When West then leads spades in trick 4, you don't really have an option either and you play low from hand" means you have just gone off in a cold contract: playing the ♠K makes the hand.

 

Of course, even playing the ♥8 from dummy may mean you now go off in a cold contract if a spade is returned and you misguess on another heart. I do not think the play of this hand is as routine as you think!!!! :o

 

:)

 

Please, will someone tell us whether pauses are mandatory after skip bids in Singapore? If so, East's failure to pause means nothing can be read into South's pause: he had a right to some thinking time which was removed by East's failure to follow regulations.

 

:(

 

I believe that we need to know what 3NT shows. If it is often - or usually - a balanced hand, then a heart lead, especially a heart honour lead, will often be shockingly bad. I am not so convinced as others that it is routine anyway. In view of South's thought, which will often be because of long hearts, I would not be surprised to find that a heart lead sets up a six-card heart suit in the dummy. But we need to know the N/S methods.

 

:ph34r:

 

Unless I have missed something, we know there is UI from West because he has said so in effect. I can think of no reason for the UI apart from considering doubling which shows a heart holding. Thus I believe the UI indicates a heart lead over any other lead. Thus to adjust we need to find a lead which is not a heart but which we do consider an LA. Let's poll!!!!!! ;)

[Trinidad]

Another important point: If all 4 players are (former) internationals, I really can't see how EW beat 3NT.

West switches to a spade, either before or after cashing the three hearts, and North has a guess. When he misguesses, he loses 4 spades and 3 hearts, for down three.

You are entirely right. When West switches spades it really is a guess.

 

The only thing is that if North goes up with the ♠K, it will be making or down 3, depending on the position of the honors. While if North plays low, it will be making or down 1, depending on the position of the honors. If there are no other clues, I would play low, for that exact reason. And that happens to be the winning decision. But that doesn't make it automatic (or even correct) to play low.

 

Maybe North did see another clue somewhere. That is certainly not "wild or gambling", or anything of that kind.

 

Rik

[duschek]

Assuming that players are expected to pause for approximately 10 seconds after any skip bid: I concur with the point made that South has provided West with all the time he could expect. In fact, had South passed without thinking, West could only fault his partner for committing an infraction which robbed him of that time. I would allow South some 10-15 seconds if East passes immediately, but West is on his own.

 

I think West has implicitly admitted to a BIT. Why would he come up with this "I am entitled to pause and think" nonsense if he did not pause and think?

 

I agree that a heart is a good lead. But it takes a committee of very strong players to convince me that choosing a heart for the opening lead comes with no logical alternatives. And indeed, "current/former internationals" covers quite a broad range of playing levels (in fact, only East's playing level is relevant).

 

Declarer's guessing wrong in spades is perfectly reasonable. West ponders with just the ♥AKxx in dummy's suit (I am unsure how much was known when West shifted to a spade). Might not the pause indicate the ♠A rather than the ♠Q?