mtvesuvius Posted September 9, 2009 Report Share Posted September 9, 2009 R vs W at IMPs you hold: ------AxxxxTxxxxxTx LHO deals: (2♠) - P - (4♠) - P(P) - X - (P) - ? What if it were Equal or W vs R vulnerability... Would this affect your decision? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kenrexford Posted September 9, 2009 Report Share Posted September 9, 2009 4NT. If partner picks clubs, 5♦ to pick a red suit. If partner picks diamonds, OK then. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pooltuna Posted September 9, 2009 Report Share Posted September 9, 2009 4NT. If partner picks clubs, 5♦ to pick a red suit. If partner picks diamonds, OK then. clearly you don't think partner had a penalty pass of 2♠ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kenrexford Posted September 9, 2009 Report Share Posted September 9, 2009 4NT. If partner picks clubs, 5♦ to pick a red suit. If partner picks diamonds, OK then. clearly you don't think partner had a penalty pass of 2♠ I may be wrong, but I don't think this double means that I should pass with this hand. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
655321 Posted September 9, 2009 Report Share Posted September 9, 2009 Really really bad (assuming we are talking about something other than the auto Pass). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kenrexford Posted September 9, 2009 Report Share Posted September 9, 2009 Wait a minute. I just noticed the colors as red on white. That's a little tougher. Now I'm doubting... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
the hog Posted September 9, 2009 Report Share Posted September 9, 2009 If partner does not have a penalty double of 4S, then I am finding another partner. If pd had a takeout double, she would have doubled on the last round. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
aguahombre Posted September 9, 2009 Report Share Posted September 9, 2009 If partner does not have a penalty double of 4S, then I am finding another partner. If pd had a takeout double, she would have doubled on the last round.yep. If pard couldn't act the first time because the shape was wrong for takeout, and if he couldn't bid NT the first time --and didn't want to show a two-suit gamble with 4NT, he/she would stay fixed. Partner is not asking me to bid. Would not be surprised if we get four trump tricks. :) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bill1157 Posted September 9, 2009 Report Share Posted September 9, 2009 If pds X is penalty, and can't play in either ♦'s or ♥'s opposite this hand, then he should have passed, not X'd. So 4NT is absolutely clear. If pd doesn't like it, get a new pd! Bill Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Codo Posted September 9, 2009 Report Share Posted September 9, 2009 If pds X is penalty, and can't play in either ♦'s or ♥'s opposite this hand, then he should have passed, not X'd. So 4NT is absolutely clear. If pd doesn't like it, get a new pd! Bill I am afraid you won't get many new partners from the BBFlers. :P Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
andy_h Posted September 9, 2009 Report Share Posted September 9, 2009 I say don't do this double undiscussed. These 2-way doubles of penalty or takeout depending on the number of enemy's trumps can sometimes work out badly. So...how fast was partner's pass over 2S and his X? :P Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pooltuna Posted September 9, 2009 Report Share Posted September 9, 2009 Wait a minute. I just noticed the colors as red on white. That's a little tougher. Now I'm doubting.......sanity? No Problem! We can confirm. You are definitely insane :) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jillybean Posted September 9, 2009 Report Share Posted September 9, 2009 If partner does not have a penalty double of 4S, then I am finding another partner. If pd had a takeout double, she would have doubled on the last round.yep. If pard couldn't act the first time because the shape was wrong for takeout, and if he couldn't bid NT the first time --and didn't want to show a two-suit gamble with 4NT, he/she would stay fixed. Partner is not asking me to bid. Would not be surprised if we get four trump tricks. :) Good , helpful answers, good thread , thanks :) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
helene_t Posted September 9, 2009 Report Share Posted September 9, 2009 That's the thing with penalty doubles. P has five or six spades (or four good ones) so it doesn't surprise him that we are void. Should he abstain from making a penalty double because he is afraid we would pull it? Well if this double were a little bid optional then yes. But it isn't. You don't pull partner's penalty double after you have preempted and opps bid in your void, either. This is one of the few situations in modern biding were partner doesn't ask us to do something intelligent. He just asks us to pass. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Phil Posted September 9, 2009 Report Share Posted September 9, 2009 You should give this problem blind without the 'benefit' of looking at your hand. This is far from a WTP. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bid_em_up Posted September 9, 2009 Report Share Posted September 9, 2009 You don't pull partner's penalty double after you have preempted and opps bid in your void, either. Well, this would be true, except we haven't preempted, they did. :) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ArtK78 Posted September 9, 2009 Report Share Posted September 9, 2009 I cannot come up with a rational explanation for the double other than penalty. Any other explanation is impossible given the failure to act over 2♠. The fact that I am void in spades is consistent with the penalty double. Spades are 6-5-2 or 6-6-1 around the table, and RHO has a very good hand. The only problem with the double is that RHO may run to a different contract. But that is not my problem - that is partner's problem. Presumably he took that into account when he doubled 4♠. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bid_em_up Posted September 9, 2009 Report Share Posted September 9, 2009 If partner really wanted to "takeout", he would bid 4N. Additionally, it's somewhat difficult to construct a hand that could not make a takeout X of 2S but now wants to make one of 4S. I don't even need to see my hand. Pass, wtp? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
655321 Posted September 9, 2009 Report Share Posted September 9, 2009 You don't pull partner's penalty double after you have preempted and opps bid in your void, either. Well, this would be true, except we haven't preempted, they did. :)Hence Helene's use of the word 'either'. :ph34r: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Flameous Posted September 9, 2009 Report Share Posted September 9, 2009 Partner likely won't have double based on trump tricks. (If he does, the opps suck so much... or are trying stuff) I think most likely partner has something like 12-15 count balanced with one certain trump trick and 2-3 other likely(certain) tricks. We have one ace for pard so pass is clear cut. Without that, I would be pulling of course. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bill1157 Posted September 9, 2009 Report Share Posted September 9, 2009 I don't think anyone is saying the X isn't penalty, just that with 0=5=6=2 you can pull it if you want... Bill Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
aguahombre Posted September 9, 2009 Report Share Posted September 9, 2009 I don't think anyone is saying the X isn't penalty, just that with 0=5=6=2 you can pull it if you want... Billactually a lot of people are saying you cannot pull it if you want. They are wrong. You can legally pull it, but probably won't do it again, with this same partner. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pooltuna Posted September 9, 2009 Report Share Posted September 9, 2009 I don't think anyone is saying the X isn't penalty, just that with 0=5=6=2 you can pull it if you want... Billactually a lot of people are saying you cannot pull it if you want. They are wrong. You can legally pull it, but probably won't do it again, with this same partner. If I understand you correctly you are saying that having pulled the trigger on the 2♠ bidder he is ready to pull the plug on his CHO :) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bill1157 Posted September 9, 2009 Report Share Posted September 9, 2009 I don't think anyone is saying the X isn't penalty, just that with 0=5=6=2 you can pull it if you want... Billactually a lot of people are saying you cannot pull it if you want. They are wrong. You can legally pull it, but probably won't do it again, with this same partner. If I understand you correctly you are saying that having pulled the trigger on the 2♠ bidder he is ready to pull the plug on his CHO :) ROFLOL: good one! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
qwery_hi Posted September 9, 2009 Report Share Posted September 9, 2009 I think partner has KQJTxxxxxxAxx Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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